[Grovenet] Fw: 52% Say U.S. Has Not Become Safer

Geri ggsteele at gte.net
Sat Jun 11 16:29:58 PDT 2005


"Just a thought. I never know if my crystal ball is set on the Fantasy
Channel or the Future History Channel. Humph. Maybe it's on the Oil
Shopping Channel."

         <laugh> Know what you mean!

"Has anyone realized that there's short stretch of road to the Baghdad
airport that no one dare travel except in fear for their lives, yet almost
everyone has to use that road to get to the airport? It's only a few miles
long. Yet with over 100,000 troops in Iraq, plus all the Iraqi's in the new
security force, we can't make that one bit of road safe!"

         Yes, have heard about that a few times ...  It's one
         of the contributing factors (but second to the current
         administration's censorship of facts) to poor news
         coverage ... and journalists not being so likely to get
         in and out unharmed ... and fewer and fewer being
         on-the-spot ... (see yours, just under this).

"I won't speculate about why that's so. It suggest to me that all the
coverage on CNN, FOX and the rest aren't telling us much of anything about
what's going on there. The coverage looks like a lot of location eye-candy
to keep viewers happy. I have no illusion that I know anything about what's
going on in Iraq."

         (Did my little attachment come through?)



Geri



----- Original Message ----- 
From: Ron D'Eau Claire 
To: 'Forest Grove local interests list' 
Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 4:13 PM
Subject: RE: [Grovenet] Fw: 52% Say U.S. Has Not Become Safer


Thanks Geri!

This really shows who one can get backed into a corner in a game of "You
Lose". That's the game where someone invites you to play, so you ask how.
They say, "It's really very simple: you lose. Would you like to play again?"

In this case the USA has not been hit by another 9/11. So, obviously,
nothing that's been done since 9/11 has made us any safer. President Bush
loses. 

It's not that the President couldn't have won. If Homeland Security had
caught a gang of terrorists about to unleash a nuclear bomb in New York or
nerve gas in Los Angeles the President would have a win on his hands. Of
course it didn't happen so nothing that's been done helps. Sort of "You
Lose" gamesmanship isn't it? 

Since we stormed into Iraq I've been concerned that after we kicked over the
furniture and made a mess, we'd get bored, angry, and just leave. Leave a
nation of Iraqi's who will hate anything associated with the USA for a long,
long time. 

I've been watching for some sign that we can afford to stay or that we can
garner popular support to stay. As long as the war was a one-sided act of
aggression against a country who posed no clear direct threat against the
USA, I don't see how anyone's going to sell the occupation to the US
citizens over time. 

Especially since the President also promised us that the Iraqi's would
welcome us with open arms. He forgot to say those open arms would be holding
rocket-propelled grenades, automatic weapons and bombs. 

Has anyone realized that there's short stretch of road to the Baghdad
airport that no one dare travel except in fear for their lives, yet almost
everyone has to use that road to get to the airport? It's only a few miles
long. Yet with over 100,000 troops in Iraq, plus all the Iraqi's in the new
security force, we can't make that one bit of road safe! 

I won't speculate about why that's so. It suggest to me that all the
coverage on CNN, FOX and the rest aren't telling us much of anything about
what's going on there. The coverage looks like a lot of location eye-candy
to keep viewers happy. I have no illusion that I know anything about what's
going on in Iraq.  

I wonder if the UN can clean up the mess for us? 

I have an image of Baghdad in 2015 after the last American has long gone,
our puppet government collapses and we are pleading for their oil and Osama
Bin Laden rides into Baghdad a triumphant hero. Sort of like Fidel Castro
did after our guy Bautista was run out of town. 

Just a thought. I never know if my crystal ball is set on the Fantasy
Channel or the Future History Channel. Humph. Maybe it's on the Oil Shopping
Channel.

Ron D'Eau Claire 


 



-----Original Message-----
From: grovenet-bounces at rdrop.com [mailto:grovenet-bounces at rdrop.com] On
Behalf Of Geri
Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 3:29 PM
To: GroveNet
Subject: [Grovenet] Fw: 52% Say U.S. Has Not Become Safer



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WashingtonPost.com

Poll Finds Dimmer View of Iraq War

52% Say U.S. Has Not Become Safer

By Dana Milbank and Claudia Deane
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, June 8, 2005; Page A01

 
For the first time since the war in Iraq began, more than half of the
American public believes the fight there has not made the United States
safer, according to a new Washington Post-ABC News poll.

While the focus in Washington has shifted from the Iraq conflict to Social
Security and other domestic matters, the survey found that Americans
continue to rank Iraq second only to the economy in importance -- and that
many are losing patience with the enterprise.

Nearly three-quarters of Americans say the number of casualties in Iraq is
unacceptable, while two-thirds say the U.S. military there is bogged down
and nearly six in 10 say the war was not worth fighting -- in all three
cases matching or exceeding the highest levels of pessimism yet recorded.
More than four in 10 believe the U.S. presence in Iraq is becoming analogous
to the experience in Vietnam.

Perhaps most ominous for President Bush, 52 percent said war in Iraq has not
contributed to the long-term security of the United States, while 47 percent
said it has. It was the first time a majority of Americans disagreed with
the central notion Bush has offered to build support for war: that the fight
there will make Americans safer from terrorists at home. In late 2003, 62
percent thought the Iraq war aided U.S. security, and three months ago 52
percent thought so.

Overall, more than half -- 52 percent -- disapprove of how Bush is handling
his job, the highest of his presidency. A somewhat larger majority -- 56
percent -- disapproved of Republicans in Congress, and an identical
proportion disapproved of Democrats.

There were signs, however, that Bush and Republicans in Congress were
receiving more of the blame for the recent standoffs over such issues as
Bush's judicial nominees and Social Security. Six in 10 respondents said
Bush and GOP leaders are not making good progress on the nation's problems;
of those, 67 percent blamed the president and Republicans while 13 percent
blamed congressional Democrats. For the first time, a majority, 55 percent,
also said Bush has done more to divide the country than to unite it.

The surge in violence in Iraq since the new government took control -- 80
U.S. troops and more than 700 Iraqis died in May alone amid a rash of
bombings -- has been accompanied by rising gloom about the overall fight
against terrorists. By 50 percent to 49 percent, Americans approved of the
way Bush is handling the campaign against terrorism, down from 56 percent
approval in April, equaling the lowest rating he has earned on the issue
that has consistently been his core strength with the public.

The dissipating support for the Iraq war is of potential military concern,
because, as Marine Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis wrote in a note to his troops as
he led them back into Iraq in February 2004, "our friendly strategic center
of gravity is the will of the American people."

Some authorities on war and public opinion said the figures indicate that
pessimism about the war in Iraq has reached a dangerous level. "It appears
that Americans are coming to the realization that the war in Iraq is not
being won and may well prove unwinnable," said retired Army Col. Andrew J.
Bacevich, a professor at Boston University. "That conclusion bleeds over
into a conviction that it may not have been necessary in the first place."

That is the view of poll respondent Margaret Boudreaux, 63, a casino worker
living in Oakdale, La. "I don't think it's going well -- there's too much
killing," she said, worrying that the Iraq invasion could move more enemies
to violence. "I think that some of the people, if they could, would get
revenge for what we've done."

"You hear a lot about Saddam but nothing about Osama bin Laden. I don't
think he [Bush] does enough to deal with the problems of terrorism. . . .
He's done a lot of talking, but we haven't seen real changes," said another
poll respondent, Kathy Goyette, 54, a San Diego nurse. "People are getting
through airport security with things that are unbelievable. . . . I don't
think he learned from 9/11."

While Bush has shelved his routine speeches about terrorism, and Congress
has turned to domestic issues, fear of terrorism has receded from the public
consciousness. Only 12 percent called it the nation's top priority, behind
the economy, Iraq, health care and Social Security.

The drop in Bush's approval ratings on fighting terrorism came
disproportionately from political independents. In March, 63 percent of
independents approved of Bush's job combating terrorism. By April this had
fallen to 54 percent. And in this weekend's survey, 40 percent gave him good
marks.

The poll suggests that views on the Iraq war's impact also remain highly
partisan. Three in four Republicans said the Iraq invasion has boosted
domestic security, while three in four Democrats said it has not. Political
independents lean negative on the issue: About six in 10 said the war has
not made Americans safer.

Overall, Bush's 48 percent job approval rating was essentially unchanged
from the 47 percent rating he received in a late-April poll. And there was
growth in the proportion of people who said the economy was doing well: 44
percent, up from 37 percent in April.

But the public took a generally gloomy view of the White House and Congress.
A plurality said Bush is doing worse in his second term than in his first,
and 58 percent said he is not concentrating on the things that matter most
to them -- the worst showing Bush has had in this measure in Post-ABC polls.

Congress fared no better. The proportion of the public disapproving of the
legislative body was at its highest since late 1998, during President Bill
Clinton's impeachment. More people said they would look at a candidate other
than their sitting representative than at any point in nearly eight years.
For the first time since April 2001, Democrats (46 percent) were trusted
more than Republicans (41 percent) to cope with the nation's problems. But
at the same time, favorability ratings for the Democratic Party, at 51
percent, tied their all-time low.

A total of 1,002 randomly selected adults were interviewed by telephone June
2 to 5 for this Post-ABC News poll. The margin of sampling error for the
overall results is plus or minus three percentage points.

The poll also found disapproval or division when it came to Bush's
performance on several other recent, high-profile issues. One-third of those
surveyed approved of the way Bush is handling federal funding of embryonic
stem cell research, while 55 percent disapproved. The public was divided on
the president's handling of judicial nominations, with 46 percent approving
and 44 percent disapproving. And half said they were opposed to drilling in
Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge, a proposal backed by Bush and
being debated in Congress.

But the most striking trend identified by the survey was the spreading
impatience over Iraq and national security matters. While six in 10 were
confident that the United States was not violating the rights of detainees
at the military base in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, Americans were more skeptical
that the government is protecting the rights of U.S. citizens at home. Only
half said Americans' rights were being adequately protected, down from 69
percent in September 2003.

James Burk, a sociologist at Texas A&M University, said disillusionment
about Iraq may have grown to the point that policymakers will have
difficulty reversing it. "People all across the country know people in Iraq
[so] there's a direct connection to the war," he said. Burk sees a
"disjuncture" between upbeat administration rhetoric and realities the
public perceives. "These data suggest we will soon reach the point, if we
haven't yet reached the point, where that kind of language will seem too out
of touch."

Polling director Richard Morin contributed to this report.

C 2005 The Washington Post Company

(Article at:  http://tinyurl.com/7rnqh )

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