[Grovenet] grenada/ was that's one big flag.

Sat Apr 25 17:58:14 PDT 2009

Yep, I remember that "glorious" little war. Something akin to the  
invasion of Panama, ostensibly to capture old "Pineapple Face"  
Noriega for being involved in the dope trade. If that is a true  
reason for an invasion, we'd have to go after half the dictators in  
Latin America.
Grenada, as I recall, was invaded for fears of a "comyanist  
invasion" (a Cuban Army construction corps or some such was in the  
country). Sadly, another example of young American lives thrown away  
for a specious rationale.

Walt
On Apr 25, 2009, at 4:46 PM, Glenn Berkheimer wrote:

>
> Wow..I did not realize that many people remembered the war.  I sure  
> do, that is because one day I was rousted out of my bed and told to  
> get to the base ASAP out of the blue.
> I was part of a Medical Field Surgical Support unit of my Naval  
> Hospital and before the next day was out I had 19 dead and 191  
> wounded men on my hands and I was standing on a beach watching this  
> and not believing I was there.  The only thing good about it was it  
> was very short.  My son came to me earlier this year as he was  
> approaching graduation at Pacific because he had changed his mind.   
> His entire Pacific schooling had been in preperation for the  
> Optometry school.  My dad and grandfather were Optometrists and I  
> had been a licensed Optician as well as a surgical tech in  
> Ophthalmology but he had decided he wanted to take it one step more  
> and be a M.D. so I had said sure, to my amazement he came to me  
> with a listing about a med school he wanted to go to and low and  
> behold there it was, the Medical School on Grenada, the same one  
> that Ronald Regan had used as our excuse to invade the island.  Our  
> goal was supposed to be to rescue the students at this very med  
> school.
>
>
>
>> From: allnutt at verizon.net
>> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2009 12:47:56 -0700
>> To: grovenet at rdrop.com
>> Subject: [Grovenet] grenada/ was that's one big flag.
>>
>> Believe it or not, the war in Grenada was a brief topic here in on
>> grovenet (probably too brief).
>> Though at the time it was mentioned, the Iraq war was starting and
>> there was disagreement that the Iraq war would be as 'small' as the
>> war in Grenada.
>> Some of us thought there was no such thing as a small war, and if
>> there was a small war it still wouldn't be a good one either.
>>  From what I hear on the flag topic, nobody is really objecting to a
>> flag, the only objection is the size of this one and whether its size
>> implies meanings beyond what a regular sized flag would.
>>
>> Katie
>>
>>
>> On Apr 25, 2009, at 12:32 PM, Glenn Berkheimer wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I also believe that we, as citizens of Forest Grove, should have
>>> had the right to decide on this.  I am a veteran of the war in
>>> Grenada ( although most of you have no idea what that was, sad
>>> because I lost several of my friends that horrible day ) and I do
>>> like the flag on this site, I remember seeing it on the beach and
>>> remember how glad I was to see it while we were pinned down with
>>> enemy fire,  but I do have some negative thoughts about how big it
>>> is and this SHOULD have NOT have been a administrative decision.  I
>>> am not saying that it would have turned out any different and I
>>> myself would most likely have said yes to it but I would have said
>>> yes to it as a different size I think.
>>> Glenn
>>>
>>>
>>>> Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2009 17:28:37 -0700
>>>> From: isis23ra at yahoo.com
>>>> To: grovenet at rdrop.com
>>>> Subject: [Grovenet] Who got to choose: That's one big flag
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The most disturbing thing to me is that the citizens of Forest
>>>> Grove were not allowed to be part of the process for deciding to
>>>> fly this huge flag.
>>>>
>>>> The mayor had talks with the donor and that was it?  Not very
>>>> democratic.....
>>>>
>>>> Some people like to wear "big hair" - I guess Forest Grove is
>>>> insecure in it's patriotism and has to wear a big flag.....
>>>>
>>>> Alana
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --- On Fri, 4/24/09, Steve Jerrett <stevedj at teleport.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> From: Steve Jerrett <stevedj at teleport.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Grovenet] That's one big flag
>>>>> To: "Forest Grove local interests list" <grovenet at rdrop.com>
>>>>> Date: Friday, April 24, 2009, 11:49 AM
>>>>> Holly,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> When did the U.S. flag become a pro-war, anti choice,
>>>>> anti-gay, anti women
>>>>> etc. symbol?  Why do you see this flag as an icon of
>>>>> everything you see as
>>>>> negative about our country ?
>>>>>
>>>>> Why don't you see it as representative of
>>>>> everyone-gays, straights,
>>>>> homeless, wealthy, etc., etc.. Why doesn't it illicit a
>>>>> feeling of pride in
>>>>> the fact that we have the freedoms of opinion, religion,
>>>>> sexual orientation,
>>>>> etc. that make us such a unique civilization. Why do you
>>>>> feel that it
>>>>> doesn't also represent YOUR Forest Grove? Don't you
>>>>> feel the least bit
>>>>> apprehensive in being so audaciosly prejudicial in your
>>>>> assumptions about
>>>>> the "anonymous family" regardless of  your
>>>>> rhetorically postured approach?
>>>>> Why do you feel the need to chastise and belittle those
>>>>> that differ in
>>>>> opinion as "tasteless or unprogressive?"
>>>>>
>>>>> I find your level of intolerance  disturbingly ironic.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Steve
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Holly T." <feralcattamer at yahoo.com>
>>>>> To: "Forest Grove local interests list"
>>>>> <grovenet at rdrop.com>
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 10:54 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Grovenet] That's one big flag
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree, Walt. I will not mince words. The thing is
>>>>> hideously grotesque
>>>>> IMHO. Betsy Ross must be turning over in her grave.
>>>>>
>>>>> As Tom Robbins said in his novel, Fierce Invalids Home from
>>>>> Hot Climates,
>>>>> "The more advertising I see, the less I want to
>>>>> buy."
>>>>>
>>>>> I feel frightfully embarrassed to be a Forest Grove
>>>>> resident because of this
>>>>> monstrous display of "patriotism". I fear that
>>>>> anyone who drives through
>>>>> Forest Grove, upon being blindsighted by this abhorant
>>>>> flag, will think that
>>>>> our community is overrun by redneck Republicans who are
>>>>> pro-war,
>>>>> anti-choice, anti-gay, anti-women, and against spending tax
>>>>> dollars to help
>>>>> people and the environment. That's not MY Forest Grove
>>>>> and I resent my city
>>>>> being portrayed in this tasteless, conservative,
>>>>> unprogressive manner.
>>>>>
>>>>> The next time I pass the bus stop between Safeway and
>>>>> Goodwill and see all
>>>>> those homeless people standing around less than a block
>>>>> away from this
>>>>> monstrous flag, I will not be able to keep from wondering,
>>>>> "How many of them
>>>>> could be fed for a very, very long time for what that
>>>>> monstrosity cost?"
>>>>>
>>>>> For me, the mark of a true patriot is how much time and
>>>>> energy you spend
>>>>> helping your fellow citizens. It's all about how much
>>>>> good you do for your
>>>>> community. Not how big your flag is, how many wars
>>>>> you've illegally and
>>>>> immorally and imperialistically waged against the wrong
>>>>> enemy, and how many
>>>>> forests you've cut down in the name of capitalism. I
>>>>> thought we got past all
>>>>> that ridiculous flag waving and conservative leanings when
>>>>> Dubya was finally
>>>>> booted out at long last and Obama was sworn in. I thought
>>>>> there was a
>>>>> rebirth in this country. A rebirth whereby people would do
>>>>> their best to
>>>>> rebuild our nation, to undo the horrific damage done by the
>>>>> Bush
>>>>> Administration, and to help each other.
>>>>>
>>>>> I wonder how much money this "anonymous family"
>>>>> who donated this crass
>>>>> monstrosity gave to charities this year. How much did they
>>>>> roll up their
>>>>> sleeves to help those less fortunate than themselves? I
>>>>> wonder.
>>>>>
>>>>> Holly Tsur
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>> From: Walt Wentz <waltw at teleport.com>
>>>>> To: Forest Grove local interests list
>>>>> <grovenet at rdrop.com>
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 9:32:03 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Grovenet] That's one big flag
>>>>>
>>>>> Not to be "unpatriotic" or anything, but it
>>>>> strikes me as somewhat
>>>>> like the burger-joint-chain gimmick of a few years ago--
>>>>> when local
>>>>> sign codes limited the size of their signs, they just flew
>>>>> humungous
>>>>> American flags to attract attention to themselves.
>>>>> It is astonishing, even a bit overwhelming.
>>>>> Walt
>>>>> On Apr 23, 2009, at 8:49 AM, Allen Warren wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Bigger is better? One better than the Jones'?
>>>>> "Because we
>>>>>> can!"? :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Allen Warren
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>> From: Steven <NoSpam03 at comcast.net>
>>>>>> To: Forest Grove local interests list
>>>>> <grovenet at rdrop.com>
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 8:26:21 AM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Grovenet] That's one big flag
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is there a good explanation for why there is a
>>>>> humongous flag?
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: grovenet-bounces at rdrop.com [mailto:grovenet-
>>>>>> bounces at rdrop.com]On
>>>>>> Behalf Of Bob Browning
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 7:47 AM
>>>>>> To: Forest Grove local interests list
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Grovenet] That's one big flag
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No chuck, Chuck!! Any flag you can see from one end of
>>>>> town to
>>>>>> the other
>>>>>> is one humongous flag!! I wonder how long until the
>>>>> City has no
>>>>>> money to buy
>>>>>> the replacement flag when this one is all tattered in
>>>>> about 12 to 14
>>>>>> months?? Or, maybe the Mayor is going to come up with
>>>>> the
>>>>>> additional funds
>>>>>> needed??
>>>>>>
>>>>>> bob
>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>>>>
>>>>>> chuck wrote:
>>>>>> Saw the flag yesterday as I was leaving town for work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's - um - one - HUGE - flag.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Wow.------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> GroveNet at rdrop.com
>>>>>> http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/grovenet
>>>>>
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>>>>> GroveNet mailing list
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> GroveNet mailing list
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>>>>
>>>>
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