[Grovenet] Lies ....... lies.... by the liberals

Thu May 14 13:20:21 PDT 2009

The United States of America was founded by men wanting to have Freedom of Choice: freedom in worship, freedom from unfair taxation and freedom from the tyranny of the English Crown.  Our Founding Fathers did seek Divine Providence, but they were by no means without Vice.  Ben Franklin, as an example, was quite the bawdy fellow who had numerous mistresses throughout his life, a truth continuously suppressed at it wasn't in good keeping with the ideal Christian we believed all of our Founding Fathers to be.  And let's not forget how most, if not all, our Founding Fathers owned Slaves.  Also remember that Thomas Jefferson had children by one of his Slaves.  Our Founding Fathers definitely weren't pillars of Morality.

And if we look at our Nation's history through the eyes of the Native American, most of us are, to Native Americans, "Illegals": we came, we grabbed land and claimed it "ours", and we told the Natives what they could and could not have, where they could and could not live, how they could and could not live.  How moral is that?

In terms of the mess we're in today, and it's a mess that's world-wide, step back in time to the late 1920's here in the U.S. and you'll see parallels to today.  There's a lot to the saying of "Power corrupts.  Absolute power corrupts absolutely."  Barack Obama certainly isn't perfect.  Neither was GW Bush, or Clinton, or George H. Bush for that matter.  Just like our Founding Fathers.

I don't 100% agree with everyone here on Grovenet, just as I don't 100% agree with everyone where I spent the first 20+ years of my life in Ohio, but that's a good thing.  I like the healthy debates we have on Grovenet.  It's exactly what I believe our Founding Fathers would want.  And if I believe strongly enough in wanting to make a change, I'll do exactly what the original Founders did and attempt to make a difference through getting involved in Government by running for office (a yearning I'm starting to feel more interest in).

I don't want to go back in time.  I want to take learnings of the past and shape the future.

Allen Warren

________________________________
From: "Jamsm at aol.com" <Jamsm at aol.com>
To: grovenet at rdrop.com
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 11:03:15 AM
Subject: [Grovenet] Lies ....... lies.... by the liberals

AND my half cent worth...

CHANGE!  Yes we need change in the Great United States of  America.
We need to role the clock back and get principles and morality back in the  
people and country.

The current financial crises on wall street, in big business, and even  
with the lowly home owner that bought/borrowed more than they can  repay 
reflect this lack of moral principles.  It is all related!

As is typical, the Utopian seekers continue to attempt  to change our great 
country to the worse.
The United States of  America was founded on Christian values and 
principles. It surely was not  founded on 'anything goes', a 'me me'  or a 'I can do 
whatever I want so  long as it doesn't bother my neighbor'.  Oh, lets make 
it mandatory that  everyone has equal wealth!  Got news for you - Star Trek 
is a fictional  story.

Why should the tax payers bail out companies that ripped everyone off while 
getting rich.  They should go bankrupt and the immoral leaders of those  
companies properly fined and punished.  The taxpayer should not be paying  
for all the illegal aliens (definition for those liberals that will want to  
twist my meaning: those that are staying in this country illegally or that  
entered the country illegally) that purchased homes that they cannot  afford. 
  All the  homeowners that  purchased/refinanced homes with unreasonable 
mortgages should pay or lose their  possessions.  Ah, but the "great one" 
(B.O.) has brought all of his  friends from Wall Street, Freddie, and Mac to DC 
with him.  The  'savior' has let the liberal House and Senate do as they  
please and they are busy enacting laws that will destroy this great  country.  
"He" was behind the very reasons that the housing industry  imploded.  How 
sorrowful this country will be.  [A small prediction...  the economy will 
continue to improve until just before the next election; then  "he" will come 
out with his lies and the economy will collapse  again. Ya'all just wait 
until all the new taxes come your way can  you. LOL. Will be surprised if they 
don't tax your gas from eating too  many Mexican beans.]

Years ago, many laws were enacted by the states that prohibit acts  and 
conduct that the homosexual community participate in.  These laws are  often 
ignored today, though most states still have them on the books.  These laws 
are like many that are for the most part unenforceable when the  morality of 
the people involved has degraded and refuse to report or  prosecute those 
that break the laws. 

It is obvious that you cannot legislate morality.  Thus, we need  to teach 
and bring morality back into our society- that starts in the home,  Church 
and schools.  Many of our churches are no longer teaching  God's word, but  
teach the liberal view of 'tell me what I want to hear'  and 'make me feel 
good all over' or teach that 'you' are your own  God.  Many churches today may 
claim Christianity, but in fact are  anything but.  Oh, but wait, our 
schools are controlled by the  liberal hippie utopian loving part of our 
society.  It has  taken years for them to teach and spread their utopian  agenda.  
Today, many probably do not even realize their beliefs most  likely 
originated with the 'free love', immoral,  utopian seekers.  It will likely take 
years to  undo the damage the pot smoking hippies started.  If we are  
unable to change our ways, this great country will continue to become more  
divided until it turns on itself or is over thrown by someone  else.

The liberals continue to rewrite history to meet their expectations,  
accuse the conservatives of the very things that they (the liberals) are  
actually guilty of doing......

Oh what have I done!  Shut up already!  ...  said things that a liberal 
loving  town that is over run by illegals, liberal Californians and people 
enthralled by  the liberal movement do not want to hear and will reject.  I  
will now  be called all kinds of names, made fun of; ridiculed, and  
attacked for everything they can dream up or reword.  OR this will be  quietly 
ignored.

Yes, I know - there are some in FG that are not a part of the craziness  
that has taken over our great country.

Sure am glad I  moved to  where it was like stepping back in time.  Though, 
the liberal movement is  knocking on the door here too.

Please avoid any name calling.  Above I did not mention any names other 
than B.O. and did not make any  personal attacks on any of the liberals on 
this board.  After I  was attacked when I first came to the board,
I have quietly read this board  for years and will likely go back into 
obscurity again.

May God bless you in all that you  do.
Ex-Oregonian
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