From jray3 at aol.com Fri Aug 1 01:04:54 2008 From: jray3 at aol.com (jray3 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2008 04:04:54 -0400 Subject: [Oeva-list] Your article on the PGE charging station for plug-in hybrids. Message-ID: <8CAC1C46A9D246C-DD4-2AB2@webmail-nf10.sim.aol.com> Dear Mr. Rivera, Thank you for the coverage of PGE's pioneering installation of new charging stations for plug-in vehicles.? However, you made a significant factual error when referring to all-electric cars. Only a subclass of electric vehicles, known as Neighborhood Electric Vehicles, is limited to 25 mph.? Fully street-legal and highway-capable electric cars have been?prowling the streets of?Portland for many years now,?including both OEM vehicles, such as the electric Ford Ranger and Chevy S-10, and custom vehicles like the World's Quickest Street-Legal Electric Vehicle, which has been reported on many times in the pages of your fine paper.? Please review the Oregonian archives, as well as the following websites for verification that such cars?do by no means?"suffer from federal speed limits of 25 mph, high prices and technology glitches".? For less money than many weekend-hot-rodders spend on cubic inches and chrome, Portland's own John Wayland has built a car that eats musclecars for lunch, and then sedately cruises home on city streets without emitting a pound of carbon or consuming an ounce of oil. Members of the Oregon Electric Vehicle Association have been making use of the city's existing charging stations (which you did not mention) since they were installed over ten years ago, and use their cars on the highway every day,?costing all of about two cents per mile's worth of?energy. http://www.plasmaboyracing.com/whitezombie.php www.nedra.com www.evalbum.com www.oeva.org ? >From the Oregonian Archives..... August 26, 2006 Electric drag racer shocks disbelievers SUMMARY: John Wayland says his battery-powered Datsun can go from 0 to 60 mph in 3.5 seconds Inside John Wayland's garage in east Portland are two of the most unusual 1972 Datsuns one might ever see. One is white and covered in sponsor decals. It is a little drag racer with enormous power, known as "White Zombie." The other is blue, polished, with immaculate interior and a state-of-the-art stereo. Cheryl, John's wife, sometimes drives the Full article: 866 words Regards, Jay Donnaway www.karmanneclectric.blogspot.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080801/c0d6d866/attachment-0001.html From javabrewery at yahoo.com Fri Aug 1 11:19:37 2008 From: javabrewery at yahoo.com (Sonny N.) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 11:19:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Oeva-list Digest, Vol 58, Issue 1 Message-ID: <179095.6649.qm@web84304.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Tim, Thanks for these excellent notes.? Gives an idea about what the broader industry is thinking about and planning.? It might help to post it on the OEVA website for people that are not in the mailing list.? Cheers, Sonny ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 22:21:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Tim Kutscha Subject: [Oeva-list] Conference Report from Meeting of the Minds To: oeva-list at oeva.org Message-ID: <399727.32982.qm at web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi OEVA folks, I spent the last two days attending the Meeting of the Minds conference at the Portland Art Museum and wanted to share with you all the notes I took from the meetings.? I also had a chance to talk with Rick Durst about the new EV charging stations going up around town.? If you see a charging station, please use it so people can see the value of the stations. Let me know if you have comments or questions about the notes below.? They are quite lengthly. Cheers, Tim Kutscha OEVA Chair ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080801/43c70512/attachment.html From gary.graunke at intel.com Fri Aug 1 12:34:03 2008 From: gary.graunke at intel.com (Graunke, Gary) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 12:34:03 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Intel EV owners Message-ID: If you are an Intel EV owner, or know of other Intel EV owners who are not OEVA members on this list, please email me off-list. We are trying to estimate how many people at each campus could use EV/PHEV charging. Any other data sources are welcome! Gary -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080801/008a0930/attachment.html From oeva_treas at verizon.net Fri Aug 1 12:37:37 2008 From: oeva_treas at verizon.net (OEVA Treasurer) Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2008 12:37:37 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] potbox In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <008d01c8f40e$0e32f840$2a98e8c0$@net> I bought one of these 3 years ago for $45. It ships from India. Workmanship looks a little crude, like hand made. I have not installed it yet, but I am sure it will work just fine at half the price of the Curtis potbox. http://www.fourthgen.net/Pot1.jpg Rick Barnes OEVA Treas From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of AlphaWaveE at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2008 9:23 AM To: oeva-list at oeva.org Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] potbox Hey you all, Wondering what the usual cost for potentiometers are? Is item # 150 274 666 090 on ebay a good price and product as far as anyone can tell? Thanks, Wade _____ Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080801/dd7abe35/attachment.html From philnlynn at comcast.net Sat Aug 2 09:00:08 2008 From: philnlynn at comcast.net (Phil Baus) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 09:00:08 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Sevcon Millipak Controller Message-ID: <006501c8f4b9$05acd8c0$0b64a8c0@D74KV891> The electric motorcycle is coming along and the wiring is almost done. I need information on the Sevcon MillipaK controller. Is there a local company that can reprogram one? Does anyone have a source for a manual? Thanks in advance for your help Phil Baus Vancouver -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080802/fbebdfc2/attachment.html From dabrown at ieee.org Sat Aug 2 19:04:46 2008 From: dabrown at ieee.org (Dan Brown) Date: Sat, 02 Aug 2008 19:04:46 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Oeva-list Digest, Vol 58, Issue 3 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000001c8f50d$4e27f2c0$ea77d840$@org> My ev currently has the fourthgen pot. Works fine. Note, their QA might not be as great as the one installed seems to be in spec wrt resistance (0-5.1K). However, I have a backup (brand new) that has a range of 0-4.7K ohms. This is fine for my purposes; just thought you should know. Dan Beaverton Bradley GTE ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2008 12:37:37 -0700 From: "OEVA Treasurer" Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] potbox To: , Message-ID: <008d01c8f40e$0e32f840$2a98e8c0$@net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I bought one of these 3 years ago for $45. It ships from India. Workmanship looks a little crude, like hand made. I have not installed it yet, but I am sure it will work just fine at half the price of the Curtis potbox. http://www.fourthgen.net/Pot1.jpg Rick Barnes OEVA Treas From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 22:02:14 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 22:02:14 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Conference Report from Meeting of the Minds In-Reply-To: <399727.32982.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <399727.32982.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808022202r63ccc19ue9c52f9c8c5656f6@mail.gmail.com> Tim, Thanks for attending this and taking & sharing such great notes. My comments on the notes: "Toyota admits to Peak Oil" - It is nice to see this. A Shell Oil exec recently made similar admissions. It is good to see the campaign of denial ending. Admitting things will change is the first step to making a transition plan that is not a global tragedy. Predictions are a particular interest of mine. This conference had some whoppers. They predict mass migration to the NW due to climate change is an interesting one. They predict the fuel cells will be "it" in 30 years is also interesting. Very few predictions about the state of technology in some future time have been correct. Sooo many things change in unforeseeable way that solutions are found in ways not even possible today. Nano-tech is in its infancy and could change the game. They compared fuel cells to today's lithium ion batteries and declared fuel cells the eventual winner, that ignores all the progress (about 10% per year), that batteries will make over that time. Batteries have moved from PbA, to NiMH, to Lithium; each time with leaps in performance. Zinc-air, hot sodium, or ultra-capacitors could be the next evolutionary step. The "think long term" comments were great. I changed my sig-file to something that might encourage long term thinking :) The "War on Climate" quote made me laugh. "we need a War on Climate", seems like we already have that :) We need a "War on Climate Change". I was surprised that there was nothing about super-high efficiency personal transportation. Make cars light weight (carbon fiber) and aerodynamic and you can double the fuel efficiency. Then make it a plug-in and effectively double the gas mileage again. Run it on 50%+ bio-fuel (non-food sourced like algae and post-consumer fry oil) and you have cut its crude oil consumption again by half. Amory Lovins, Rocky Mountain Institute, claims that with these steps (all which we know how to do today), we could have cars consuming only 3% of the crude of today's vehicles. Meaning, we would not have to import any oil and they would pollute much less. Regards, -Pat How would you prefer to die? a) Global Oil War b) Global Climate Change c) Nuclear Holocaust I choose "d" None of the above Solar powered transportation works On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Tim Kutscha wrote: > Hi OEVA folks, > > I spent the last two days attending the Meeting of the Minds conference at > the Portland Art Museum and wanted to share with you all the notes I took > from the meetings. > > I also had a chance to talk with Rick Durst about the new EV charging > stations going up around town. If you see a charging station, please use it > so people can see the value of the stations. > > Let me know if you have comments or questions about the notes below. They > are quite lengthly. > > Cheers, > Tim Kutscha > OEVA Chair > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Conference Notes from Meeting of the Minds 2008 > http://www.meetingoftheminds.org July 30-31 Portland Art Museum > > This is just a list of factoids I gleaned from the conference, mostly in > chronological order: > > Opening speaker from Toyota: Irv Miller > 2009 doing fleet tests of PHEVs > 2010 will have 100s of PHEVs under test to find the "sweet spot" for > lithium batteries > Lithiums must be very high quality to last and work well for mass > production > Toyota admits to Peak Oil, partnering with other groups to adapt > > The Road Ahead: talk by Michael Meyer (The From-To discussion) > From: just cars To: a variety of transport (bikes, walking, bus, EV, > train) > From: building new infrastructure To: maintaining current infrastructure > From: focus on transportation To: system view including food and the > environment > From: raw land use To: urban planning to meet the needs of the community > From: Seeing environment as a constraint To: working to meet environmental > needs > From: Cheap energy with oil To: diminishing energy due to Peak Oil > From: Looking at personal cars To: seeing all transportation including > freight > From: Meeting local transport needs To: working with the global > transportation system > From: Transportation first To: Community first > > All future growth is in urban population centers > Our infrastructure is failing and we don't have funds to maintain it > All the wealth is in the "mega-regions" like the Portland/Vancouver/Seattle > area > Technology is getting better but we'll have to work with less amount of > more-expensive fuel > If we use less gasoline, the gas tax goes down: where do we get our > funding? > "Sustainable Mobility" is the conference buzzword encompassing technology, > environment, people behavior, etc... > The name of the game is seeing things from a systems perspective by getting > people together > Before: transportation being driven by supply of cars and highways > (infrastructure) > Future: transport driven by demand management and land use > Things are urgent: we are not sustainable today and need to see the systems > perspective > Class problem: urban living is expensive, pushing lower-income people and > seniors to > the "outer edges" of cities where transportation costs are higher > Regions need flexibility to solve their local problems but still be > interconnected with other regions > Oregon is the 7th most dependent state on trade due to its freight ports > We all like to analyze the problem like a system, but we still like one > solution in the end > when the answer is probably multiple solutions. > We need defined and open standards to clearly communicate and control our > direction > Sustainable Mobility is not "alternative transportation" just like women > are not "alternative men" > > Speech by Governor Kulongowski: > Starting fleet program for PHEV Priuses > We're working toward an electrically based transportation infrastructure > involving plug-in vehicles, charging stations and a "smart" grid (V2G) > > Lunch: Impacts of climate change on the Pacific Northwest by Tim Barnett > We are pulling more water from our rivers than nature is putting back in > Places in the Soutwest like Phoenix and LA are going to be dry in 15 years > The SF bay area water situation will turn salty as the ocean level rises > and > salinates the drinking water supply. > With the Soutwest drying up and SF bay turning salty, there will be mass > migrations to the Pacific Northwest (i.e. Portland!) This is much larger > than > the Dust Bowl and will involve >10 million people (!) > > Afternoon Panel: Future technology > We are seeing the convergence of the transportation and the power industry > BPA expects PHEVs to load the system for the next 10-15 years. The grid > (with night charging) can handle 75% of the cars today. > Once the density reaches 10% (300,000 cars), it's worth turning on a > "smart" vehicle-to-grid infrastructure to even out the load (15-30 years > out) > Beyond 30 years, hydrogen fuel-cell cars seem the way to go > Fuel cell cars have far more range than battery vehicles, refuelling is > quick > and the weight-to-storage capacity ratio is 5x that of the best lithium > batteries today > BUT: fuel cell vehicles need to cut their costs 5-10x to be viable and we > need > an expensive hydrogen charging infrastructure > The power company would have three phases: > 1. time-based electricity rates to encourage charging at night > 2. having the charger auto-detect heavy grid loads and temporarily > shutting down > 3. having vehicle-to-grid "smarts" to enable using cars as a storage > device > We need to make incentives based on all externalities to push consumers in > the right direction > "It's the batteries, stupid" We need a 3000 cycle life on batteries for > them to be viable > Fuel cells are here and working well, the hydrogen charging infrastructure > clearly is NOT > We'll have to settle for lithium-ion batteries in the near future > Other issues with charging: When people plug in anywhere, how do you bill > them > Vehicle-to-grid technology requires open standards and a cheap $20 home > outlet that > gets installed during the initial construction of houses > Houses should have a standard south-facing rooftop at the correct slope for > photovoltaics > Priorities for government from a technology standpoint: > - stability in the incentive system (windmill credits need to last many > years, not just presidential term) > - R+D for the infrastructure, this is a far bigger (10x) problem then the > Apollo program > - Battery research > - Hydrogen recharging and battery recharging infrastructure > - Fuel cell R+D collaboration. Working with Germany and France easy while > US is really hard > due to IP rules and people wanting a competitive edge > - R+D for vehicle-to-grid systems and power distribution > - "If it's measured, it gets worked on" - we need metrics to drive our > behavior > - budgets are annual, these problems are 10-20 years out, we have a > short-term mindset > We ship 700 Billion dollars overseas every year to buy oil. If we spent 2 > days of oil > purchasing on R+D, we'd have 4 billion dollars > We need to work on "good" biofuels that don't offset food or other needed > items > The bigger problem is our psychology and short-term thinking, the answer is > not technological > > Day 2: > > How can we live differently that doesn't need as much driving: Meg Nealon > of LandDesign > People in the suburbs are trapped because cars are the only way they can > get places > We need mixed housing/business centers for higher density living so people > can walk, bike, > use light rail, or use a car > Technology focusses on improving the car, whereas urban planning tends to > kill the car > Issue: How do we "retrofit" suburbs for higher density living > Making dense housing requires a large percentage of those living in it to > be carless (home office?) > We need to change rapidly and across all cities, not just have pockets of > dense living > The "new" urbanism is really like the "old" urbanism that used horses and > carts to get around > ZipCar is mainstream now with 10,000 new members each month, mainly driven > by parking costs > The Pine Beetle is killing massive numbers of trees in B.C. now, we need a > "War on Climate" > and a carbon tax. We're all in this together and we need to move NOW > Barrier to change > - everyone is waiting for someone else to go first (civil engineers tend to > make conservative decisions) > - we don't have defined and open standards to make the pieces work together > - government beauracracy is slow and really hurts the small startup > businesses without the lobbying $$ > > Tolls and Taxes: where do we get the money > How you define the problem often influences the way you try to solve it > Key strategy for charging people to pay for the highway infrastructure: > "Pay for what you use" > Highways disobey this principle and are free for all users, causing massive > congestion > One solution is to use technology to track where people drive and charge > them for where they go > and at what time. See > http://psrc.org/projects/trafficchoices/summaryreport.pdf > Big issue: even electric vehicles charged with photovoltaics at home still > require an extensive > oil-based infrastructure in the form of roads and bridges > > Lunch lecture: Bill Reinert, manager of advanced technology at Toyota > Basically this was a big lecture on Peak Oil > Oil Shale is basically doing massive strip mining and using coal and > massive quantities of fresh > water to get oil > The world will have an oil "peak" in 2015 and in 2020 all world liquid > fuels will peak > This is different from the Thanksgiving 2005 estimation by the "peakniks" > because > their data is ten years old. Current data requires an annual 1.5 million > dollar subscription > that only large companies like Toyota can afford to pay > While dense urban centers are far more energy efficient, they still need an > oil infrastructure > to truck in food and other supplies to keep people alive. We might > improve for awhile, but, > in the end, we're screwed. > Some people tout diesel hybrids as being better than gasoline hybrids, but > diesels put out more > NOX green house gasses. > Batteries, even lithium-ion are just toys compared with the energy density > of liquid fuels. > Mexico is losing 15% annually on its major Cantarell oil field which makes > 70% of their > economy. Guess where the Mexicans will be migrating to. > For bio-fuels, we use the energy from coal to convert 900 gallons of fresh > water into 1 gallon > of biodiesel or 400-500 gallons of fresh water into ethanol. > Guidline for electric cars: each mile of range costs $500 (my $25,000 914 > EV gets 50 mile range!) > Pickens Plan is not far off: we have lots of natural gas to buy us some > time for a solution > What should we do: run away to a place surrounded by farmland where guns > are outlawed with > a Mediterranean climate, out of any major migration path. The Pacific > Northwest is a major > migration path target and there are lots of guns in the US. Try Japan, > New Zealand or Southern France. > The US is great in technology but awful in congressional decisions and > preparing the public for change > Bill Reinert is moving to Parker, Colorado to get away > > Final inspirational speech by Alan Webber > Innovations are always driven by the outsider, who sees reality as it is > and sees the status quo as > unacceptable. The insiders are always working to maintain the status quo. > Innovators are people who can't sleep at night knowing that things are the > way they are. > Rosanne Haggerty was an outsider that made a successful plan to eliminate > homelessness from New York > We need to network and work together instead of being in silos, working on > our own little problem. > The system is against you. Be stubborn and never give up. This is our > only chance. Good Luck. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080802/ed362314/attachment-0001.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 22:17:19 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 22:17:19 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Air batteries could pave way for electric cars Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808022217g64549548w45a091321e319a91@mail.gmail.com> http://tinyurl.com/trzincair Zinc air batteries can store five times as much electricity as a similarly sized li-ion battery. This is why they are the battery of choice for hearing aids. In 1997, Electric Fuel Corporation [EFC] reportedly drove a zinc-air powered EV van from London to Paris. Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080802/914e0bf6/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 22:25:35 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 22:25:35 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Texas to Tel Aviv Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808022225g623fbe81s7a1ff0a8a0912eeb@mail.gmail.com> http://tinyurl.com/5nnr75 T. Boone Pickens and Shai Agassi profiled. Here is my favorite quote: > His goal, said Agassi, is to make his electric car 'so cheap, so trivial, > that you won't even think of buying a gasoline car.' Once that happens, he > added, your oil addiction will be over forever. You'll be 'off heroin,' he > says, and 'addicted to milk.' > Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080802/46f46c58/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 23:48:34 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 23:48:34 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808022348t4864d2f9r38858a690a9a9be1@mail.gmail.com> Jeff, Does the charging station sub-team of OEVA have a "Charging Stations FAQ - What businesses and municipalities should know about installing Vehicle Charging Stations", with install and operating costs and liability issues. I'd like to go to the Beaverton city counsel and propose charging stations and I think Gary is working on something for his employer. I have met a couple of the Beaverton city counsel members and the major at the city's green neighborhood events when displaying my EV. On a side note, how should we refer to these? Some of the recent press referred to them as "PHEV charging stations", which is not accurate since you could plug in an EV too. Likewise calling them EV charging stations would be too narrow. Referring to them as just "charging stations" without context makes it sound like I could charge up my cell phone there. Unless someone has a better preferred name, I'll call them Vehicle Charging Stations. Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080802/fcd9b5d7/attachment.html From Rick.Durst at pgn.com Sun Aug 3 07:02:19 2008 From: Rick.Durst at pgn.com (Rick Durst) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 07:02:19 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations Message-ID: <9ECCD1FF821C4247B03C280FE8EBAEE36BAA8E0E04@APEXMAIL.corp.dom> The State of Oregon is working on a handout that is going to be jointly put out by PGE, The State and OEVA. Not all of these questions will be answered in full, just because it won't be legal advice, but it should help out. It will provide some assistance and guidelines. As for the name, we should probably just call them Plug-In Vehicle Stations. That should cover it all. Rick Durst ________________________________ From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org To: OEVA Sent: Sat Aug 02 23:48:34 2008 Subject: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations Jeff, Does the charging station sub-team of OEVA have a "Charging Stations FAQ - What businesses and municipalities should know about installing Vehicle Charging Stations", with install and operating costs and liability issues. I'd like to go to the Beaverton city counsel and propose charging stations and I think Gary is working on something for his employer. I have met a couple of the Beaverton city counsel members and the major at the city's green neighborhood events when displaying my EV. On a side note, how should we refer to these? Some of the recent press referred to them as "PHEV charging stations", which is not accurate since you could plug in an EV too. Likewise calling them EV charging stations would be too narrow. Referring to them as just "charging stations" without context makes it sound like I could charge up my cell phone there. Unless someone has a better preferred name, I'll call them Vehicle Charging Stations. Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080803/7afc5f27/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 10:16:44 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 10:16:44 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations In-Reply-To: <9ECCD1FF821C4247B03C280FE8EBAEE36BAA8E0E04@APEXMAIL.corp.dom> References: <9ECCD1FF821C4247B03C280FE8EBAEE36BAA8E0E04@APEXMAIL.corp.dom> Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808031016u3fe0e0c4ned8903b738050e99@mail.gmail.com> Thanks Rick. Having it jointly authored/sponsored it a great idea. On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 7:02 AM, Rick Durst wrote: > The State of Oregon is working on a handout that is going to be jointly put > out by PGE, The State and OEVA. > > Not all of these questions will be answered in full, just because it won't > be legal advice, but it should help out. > > It will provide some assistance and guidelines. > As for the name, we should probably just call them Plug-In Vehicle > Stations. > > That should cover it all. > > Rick Durst > > ------------------------------ > *From*: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org > *To*: OEVA > *Sent*: Sat Aug 02 23:48:34 2008 > *Subject*: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations > > Jeff, > > Does the charging station sub-team of OEVA have a "Charging Stations FAQ - > What businesses and municipalities should know about installing Vehicle > Charging Stations", with install and operating costs and liability issues. > > I'd like to go to the Beaverton city counsel and propose charging stations > and I think Gary is working on something for his employer. I have met a > couple of the Beaverton city counsel members and the major at the city's > green neighborhood events when displaying my EV. > > On a side note, how should we refer to these? Some of the recent press > referred to them as "PHEV charging stations", which is not accurate since > you could plug in an EV too. Likewise calling them EV charging stations > would be too narrow. Referring to them as just "charging stations" without > context makes it sound like I could charge up my cell phone there. Unless > someone has a better preferred name, I'll call them Vehicle Charging > Stations. > > Regards, > Pat > Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080803/b2c93d77/attachment.html From jeff.shorepower at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 13:22:10 2008 From: jeff.shorepower at gmail.com (Jeff Kim) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 13:22:10 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Oeva-list Digest, Vol 58, Issue 5 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <83b7b17c0808031322m63ec0dc2m4a1f8174698d227@mail.gmail.com> Pat, I'll post some documents on the Charging Subgroup Group Page shortly. Please not that these are preliminary and may not be ready for distribution. Anyone should be able to view this content, but let me know if you would like to be added to the email list. Here's the site: http://groups.google.com/group/oeva-charging-subgroup -- Jeff Kim Chief Operating Officer Shorepower Technologies (503) 686-8844 jkim at shorepower.com www.shorepower.com ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: patrick0101 at gmail.com > To: OEVA > Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 23:48:34 -0700 > Subject: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations > Jeff, > > Does the charging station sub-team of OEVA have a "Charging Stations FAQ - > What businesses and municipalities should know about installing Vehicle > Charging Stations", with install and operating costs and liability issues. > > I'd like to go to the Beaverton city counsel and propose charging stations > and I think Gary is working on something for his employer. I have met a > couple of the Beaverton city counsel members and the major at the city's > green neighborhood events when displaying my EV. > > On a side note, how should we refer to these? Some of the recent press > referred to them as "PHEV charging stations", which is not accurate since > you could plug in an EV too. Likewise calling them EV charging stations > would be too narrow. Referring to them as just "charging stations" without > context makes it sound like I could charge up my cell phone there. Unless > someone has a better preferred name, I'll call them Vehicle Charging > Stations. > > Regards, > Pat > Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Rick Durst > To: "'oeva-list at oeva.org'" > Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 07:02:19 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations > > The State of Oregon is working on a handout that is going to be jointly put > out by PGE, The State and OEVA. > > Not all of these questions will be answered in full, just because it won't > be legal advice, but it should help out. > > It will provide some assistance and guidelines. > As for the name, we should probably just call them Plug-In Vehicle > Stations. > > That should cover it all. > > Rick Durst > > ------------------------------ > *From*: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org > *To*: OEVA > *Sent*: Sat Aug 02 23:48:34 2008 > *Subject*: [Oeva-list] Charging Stations > > Jeff, > > Does the charging station sub-team of OEVA have a "Charging Stations FAQ - > What businesses and municipalities should know about installing Vehicle > Charging Stations", with install and operating costs and liability issues. > > I'd like to go to the Beaverton city counsel and propose charging stations > and I think Gary is working on something for his employer. I have met a > couple of the Beaverton city counsel members and the major at the city's > green neighborhood events when displaying my EV. > > On a side note, how should we refer to these? Some of the recent press > referred to them as "PHEV charging stations", which is not accurate since > you could plug in an EV too. Likewise calling them EV charging stations > would be too narrow. Referring to them as just "charging stations" without > context makes it sound like I could charge up my cell phone there. Unless > someone has a better preferred name, I'll call them Vehicle Charging > Stations. > > Regards, > Pat > Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080803/fd6b73de/attachment.html From richardturnock at comcast.net Sun Aug 3 18:30:44 2008 From: richardturnock at comcast.net (Richard Turnock) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 18:30:44 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Battery life Message-ID: I'm new to this list. (well, I was on it briefly years ago) I retired from PGE in 2004. While at PGE, I coordinated the electric go-kart races and grew the program from less than 20 vehicles to over 50 teams from high schools in OR and WA. I also helped acquire the yellow Sparrow and drove it in the Starlight Parade several years. My interest in electric vehicles continues, I don't own one. My first question has to do with batteries. The Prius keeps the batteries fully charged all the time so the life is extended by not cycling the batteries: draining them and recharging. However if I have a plug-in Prius, using the same batteries and cycle them deeper than the current Prius then the batter life is reduced and I have to spend more money over the life of the vehicle. So, comparing two hybrids with the same batteries, why would I want a plug-in hybrid? Second question: MINI Cooper electric costs $59,500. Is that what they are going to import to CA? No, can't be the same thing. Someone must have thought of converting a 2002 or 2003 MINI to electric, right, any out there? Thanks Richard Turnock -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080803/58b90b94/attachment.html From evmail4ron at yahoo.com Mon Aug 4 10:18:59 2008 From: evmail4ron at yahoo.com (Ron Jayasuriya) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 10:18:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Battery life In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <813081.73180.qm@web110107.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Richard, You bring up a couple very good questions, and I'd like to try to answer both: The answer to your question about battery life in phev conversions really depends on which conversion you are looking at.? For instance, our company offers phev conversions from Hybrids Plus.? This conversion removes the factory nickel metal hydride pack and replaces it with batteries from A123 (lithium iron phosphate).? This configuration reduces the chances that battery life will be an issue.? The Hybrids Plus PHEV conversion is very good in terms of using the most advanced technology available.? It is also expensive, which creates a barrier to entry for most people.? For instance a "PHEV-15" (conservative estimate of 15 miles of ev-only driving) starts at $21,000.? A longer range version is also available.? Other phev conversions keep the factory battery pack in place and add to it..? The most notable is from Hymotion, now owned by A123.? This conversion adds lithium batteries to extend the range of the factory pack.? Again, the lifespan of the lithium batteries should be very good.? These conversions cost around $10,000.? There are also phev conversions that use lead acid batteries in conjunction with the factory battery pack.? We hope to offer this option soon, with an estimated price around $6,000. So the answer to your question about battery life is that it really depends on which type of batteries are used.? The more you spend up front, the less you have to worry about battery replacement costs down the road. Now, about Mini Cooper ev's.? Mini has indicated that it will offer ev models in California only.? I understood that these would be leased, not sold (recall EV-1 history).? In any case our company is planning to convert a 2003 Mini.? We would like to offer this as a high end ev conversion with lithium batteries.? The price will be well under the $59K you mentioned, but has yet to be determined. Anyone interested in ev or phev conversions is welcome to email me. Thanks for your interest in electric vehicles! Ron Jayasuriya Shorepower Technologies 2351 NW York St. Portland, OR 97210 rjayasuriya at shorepower.com --- On Mon, 8/4/08, Richard Turnock wrote: From: Richard Turnock Subject: [Oeva-list] Battery life To: oeva-list at oeva.org Date: Monday, August 4, 2008, 1:30 AM ? I?m new to this list. (well, I was on it briefly years ago) I retired from PGE in 2004. While at PGE, I coordinated the electric go-kart races and grew the program from less than 20 vehicles to over 50 teams from high schools in OR and WA. I also helped acquire the yellow Sparrow and drove it in the Starlight Parade several years. My interest in electric vehicles continues, I don?t own one. ? My first question has to do with batteries. The Prius keeps the batteries fully charged all the time so the life is extended by not cycling the batteries: draining them and recharging. However if I have a plug-in Prius, using the same batteries and cycle them deeper than the current Prius then the batter life is reduced and I have to spend more money over the life of the vehicle. So, comparing two hybrids with the same batteries, why would I want a plug-in hybrid? ? Second question: MINI Cooper electric costs $59,500.? Is that what they are going to import to CA? No, can?t be the same thing. Someone must have thought of converting a 2002 or 2003 MINI to electric, right, any out there? ? Thanks Richard Turnock ? _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/2620116a/attachment-0001.html From rmerwin at aracnet.com Mon Aug 4 12:33:03 2008 From: rmerwin at aracnet.com (Ralph Merwin) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 12:33:03 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Battery life In-Reply-To: from "Richard Turnock" at Aug 03, 2008 06:30:44 PM Message-ID: <200808041933.m74JX30M002665@onyx.spiritone.com> Richard Turnock writes: > > My first question has to do with batteries. > > The Prius keeps the batteries fully charged all the time so the life is > extended by not cycling the batteries: draining them and recharging. Actually, I believe that the Prius works to keep the batteries in the "easy to manage" range of 80%-20% DOD. When I'm driving my wife's Prius and am cruising in EV mode, the display shows the battery getting drained down to a point and then the engine kicks in until the batteries are charged again. Ralph From patrick0101 at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 12:40:43 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 12:40:43 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] EV Presentation Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808041240u33ac5656p718452c2252cef5a@mail.gmail.com> Here is a great presentation on available and upcoming BEVs (NEVs and full speed) and PHEV conversions. http://righthandeng.zftp.com/EV-Summary-July-2008.ppt Enjoy, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/d49efaca/attachment.html From toolman84 at juno.com Mon Aug 4 13:18:41 2008 From: toolman84 at juno.com (toolman84 at juno.com) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 13:18:41 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] New Guy Here & EV motorcycle build Message-ID: <20080804.131841.148.9.toolman84@juno.com> Hello All, I've been interested in some kind of an EV ever since I had a short Ride in Myles' "Reach of Tide". I also visited with a few of you at Pioner Square at the EV display a few weeks ago. I [sort of] have an EV now. I converted my 15' wooden boat to electric drive, used a pair Neptune trusters (50 # thrust each I think) found on Craigslist for $150 and powered with four Trojan 105s wired series for 24 volts. My first tryout gave me only 4mph, but it came with only 8" props. Have a pair of 12" props now, but have yet to try them out. On the plus side, I used less than one volt of power for the day of silent cruising at Hagg lake. Here is a pic of the drive: http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/boats/DSCF0045.jpg My next project had to be something I can use on the road. Due to funds [lack of that is!] I'm building an EV motorcycle. Month ago I found an 85 Honda VT 500 for $300 with a bad motor but otherwise in good condition. It is a shaft drive, I chose this as I want to be as silent as posible. I have a small machine shop at my home, so I don't see too much of a problem fitting the traction motor. Here a few pics of the donor bike: http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Electric%20Motorcycle/Hon da50007.jpg http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Electric%20Motorcycle/Hon da50005.jpg This is a pic of part of the final drive on the bike I plan to fit the motor to: http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Electric%20Motorcycle/Hon da50004.jpg I'm new to this, so I'm posting my parts list here to get any input / ideas you guys have to offer. Motor: ADC K91-4003, 6.7" I'm a big guy and in the future I would like to make it into a reverse trike for all weather comfort and more battery capacity, so I want some serious horsepower. Voltage: 72, 6 x 12 Batteries: Still researching those. I want things to look good, so I might go with Optima's. I suspect I'll have to stretch the frame a bit, but should not much trouble for me. Controller: Again, still reading and looking. Found this one on Ebay item#290250001844 $300 used Curtis 1209B-6402 good for 72 volts and 450 amp. Some questions: What are your favorite sources for the above parts? Do you have any better ideas for the parts I listed? Do you have any of the parts I need in your garages, looking to save $$ anywhere I can. A little about me. I'm a maintenance mechanic at Oregon Glass in Wilsonville. Spend my days repairing some neat glass making machinery. I have a descent amount of experience with electricity, pneumatics, hydraulics, machining, welding and general tinkering. It's like getting paid to go fishing! At home I'm always building something mechanical, last major project was stuffing a fuel injected Chevrolet 350 from an ex police car into an 86 S10 pickup while retaining all the computer and engine electronics. That project is up for sale to help finance future EV ideas. Thanks, Dan Aurora OR ____________________________________________________________ Click here to find Medical Transcription Training programs. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3nFN9VqRSTv8dmKmmCnq374r136aPaLcPwFNJbFHltLI68eF/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/ca351473/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 14:08:23 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 14:08:23 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Tesla's $30K Car Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808041408v63c08cb2m3558e53d48f8651b@mail.gmail.com> Tesla plans $30k car; envisions 45 minute charging, 305 mile range http://www.leftlanenews.com/tesla-plans-30k-car-envisions-45-minute-charging-305-mile-range.html Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/24aac129/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 14:21:42 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 14:21:42 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Portland's New Plug-in Charging Stations get Media Attention Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808041421y5e4a35c7t2ba95efc59af076d@mail.gmail.com> PGE installs 'filling station of the future' in downtown Portland Daily Journal of Commerce Oregon - Portland,Oregon,USA PGE opens stations around Portland for plug-in hybrids The Oregonian - OregonLive.com - Portland,OR,USA Portland Plugs Into Curbside Chargers by RiverWire Now where are the cars? the Prius owners group And on a related topic, ShorePower wins a big contract in New York: NYS Department of Correctional Services -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/c40a8077/attachment.html From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Mon Aug 4 20:41:08 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 20:41:08 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Upcoming EVent at Washington County Fairgrounds Message-ID: <586657.62081.qm@web36902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi All, I just got word from the organizer of the Alternative Energy & Sustainable Living Show that it has been pushed out a week to September 5-7. Gary and Pat, I hope you can still make it for part of the show. Paul, would you please update the EVents calendar? See you all at the August 14th monthly meeting! (announcement coming soon) Cheers, Tim Kutscha OEVA Chair ----- Original Message ---- From: Tim Kutscha To: oeva-list at oeva.org Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 9:10:45 PM Subject: [Oeva-list] Upcoming EVent at Washington County Fairgrounds Hi All, The OEVA just got invited to show some EVs at the Alternative Energy & Sustainable Living Show out at the Washington County Fairgrounds on August 29-31. They were psyched to have electric vehicles there, so they even waived the fee for us. Since several of you are out in Hillsboro/Beaverton, I thought this would be right up your alley. This will be outdoors, so we'll probably have to set up a canopy (for shade in the sun or for dryness in the rain). Admission is free and this is right on the MAX line. Paul B., please add this to the EVents list. Ross O., would you please add this to the EVents calendar? The website is: http://www.wampromotions.com/Events.html Since this is a 3-day event, I hope we can have several folks sign up to attend the information table. We get a 10x10 spot and a place out in the field to show vehicles. Please let me know if you can show your vehicle or can attend the table at this EVent. Cheers, Tim OEVA Chair -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/048d1ad7/attachment-0001.html From matwete at comcast.net Mon Aug 4 21:29:11 2008 From: matwete at comcast.net (Myles Twete) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 21:29:11 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] New Guy Here & EV motorcycle build In-Reply-To: <20080804.131841.148.9.toolman84@juno.com> References: <20080804.131841.148.9.toolman84@juno.com> Message-ID: <005e01c8f6b3$cfb73b50$6f25b1f0$@net> Holy Toledo Batman.the Toolman lands on another list I'm on!!! Seriously, Dan, I'm glad to read you're here on the OEVA list introducing yourself. I've been with the OEVA since about 1993 now and it took me until what, 2003 (?) to convert The Reach to electric? You jumped right in and in the past year have converted the once-jet-powered "Don't Panic" to electric.and with a whacky hammerhead shark style lower drive.very cool. As for the Curtis and the 6.75" motor, they're a good start. I used an AC4002 6.75" ADC motor (60# and 6-8HP) and a 36v Curtis on The Reach before convincing myself 6mo later that I wanted an ETEK (20# and 6-8HP) and a 24-48v Alltrax controller. And these changes are so easy to do. Try new controllers.try new batteries.heck, make a hammerhead shark looking thingy at the end of an outdrive.why not? Motorcycles? No hablo motorcycles.ask Damon if he's still on this list.or others. Seriously though, come to the next OEVA meeting. -Myles From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of toolman84 at juno.com Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 1:19 PM To: oeva-list at oeva.org Subject: [Oeva-list] New Guy Here & EV motorcycle build Hello All, I've been interested in some kind of an EV ever since I had a short Ride in Myles' "Reach of Tide". I also visited with a few of you at Pioner Square at the EV display a few weeks ago. I [sort of] have an EV now. I converted my 15' wooden boat to electric drive, used a pair Neptune trusters (50 # thrust each I think) found on Craigslist for $150 and powered with four Trojan 105s wired series for 24 volts. My first tryout gave me only 4mph, but it came with only 8" props. Have a pair of 12" props now, but have yet to try them out. On the plus side, I used less than one volt of power for the day of silent cruising at Hagg lake. Here is a pic of the drive: http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/boats/DSCF0045.jpg My next project had to be something I can use on the road. Due to funds [lack of that is!] I'm building an EV motorcycle. Month ago I found an 85 Honda VT 500 for $300 with a bad motor but otherwise in good condition. It is a shaft drive, I chose this as I want to be as silent as posible. I have a small machine shop at my home, so I don't see too much of a problem fitting the traction motor. Here a few pics of the donor bike: http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Electric%20Motorcycle/Honda5 0007.jpg http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Electric%20Motorcycle/Honda5 0005.jpg This is a pic of part of the final drive on the bike I plan to fit the motor to: http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Electric%20Motorcycle/Honda5 0004.jpg I'm new to this, so I'm posting my parts list here to get any input / ideas you guys have to offer. Motor: ADC K91-4003, 6.7" I'm a big guy and in the future I would like to make it into a reverse trike for all weather comfort and more battery capacity, so I want some serious horsepower. Voltage: 72, 6 x 12 Batteries: Still researching those. I want things to look good, so I might go with Optima's. I suspect I'll have to stretch the frame a bit, but should not much trouble for me. Controller: Again, still reading and looking. Found this one on Ebay item#290250001844 $300 used Curtis 1209B-6402 good for 72 volts and 450 amp. Some questions: What are your favorite sources for the above parts? Do you have any better ideas for the parts I listed? Do you have any of the parts I need in your garages, looking to save $$ anywhere I can. A little about me. I'm a maintenance mechanic at Oregon Glass in Wilsonville. Spend my days repairing some neat glass making machinery. I have a descent amount of experience with electricity, pneumatics, hydraulics, machining, welding and general tinkering. It's like getting paid to go fishing! At home I'm always building something mechanical, last major project was stuffing a fuel injected Chevrolet 350 from an ex police car into an 86 S10 pickup while retaining all the computer and engine electronics. That project is up for sale to help finance future EV ideas. Thanks, Dan Aurora OR ____________________________________________________________ Click here to find Medical Transcription Training programs. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/949de658/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 22:47:45 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 22:47:45 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Hillsboro Mainsteet Madness Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808042247k6b4c70d6x2ae2e5f26c2828f7@mail.gmail.com> Did anyone from OEVA attend the Hillsboro Mainstreet Madness event last weekend? http://www.mainstreetmadness.org/ A friend of mine went and said that they had EVs on display including a Zap Xebra, another 3-wheeler, and a Honda Civic conversion. At first I assumed that the display must have been MCEV or EcoMotion, then when he said there was a conversion, I was puzzled. Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/e2a0018f/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 23:37:22 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 23:37:22 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Are PHEVs the Gateway to BEVs? Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808042337v518151a2g75b87cbcb4871ffd@mail.gmail.com> http://tinyurl.com/5qpq8w This article is from Nov last year, but it is one of the most insightful I have read about PHEVs and EVs and how the market place may respond to them. Cheers, Pat The EV revolution in your rear view mirror is closer than it appears -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080804/26f2a3e1/attachment.html From ken at peakfoto.com Tue Aug 5 00:38:07 2008 From: ken at peakfoto.com (Peakfoto Digital Photo Still n Video) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 00:38:07 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Oeva-list Digest, eteke motors Message-ID: - which is better for brushed or mars brusless, I 'm looking for a package for my electric motorcyle curently at 36 volts, maybe??? be going to 48?.. I have 275 amp controller it maybe weak, I'm mostly looking for lower costs.. i'd like to be able to do 45 mph, any one know of a deal for motor/contoller deal for my exsiting bike..?? From gary.graunke at intel.com Tue Aug 5 08:58:40 2008 From: gary.graunke at intel.com (Graunke, Gary) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 08:58:40 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Hillsboro Mainsteet Madness In-Reply-To: <8c28d7b50808042247k6b4c70d6x2ae2e5f26c2828f7@mail.gmail.com> References: <8c28d7b50808042247k6b4c70d6x2ae2e5f26c2828f7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: This was part of the Celebrate Hillsboro event. We were there.... The "civic" conversion was my Insight, and the 3 wheeler was Paul Burkey's Sparrow. We had a Zap there on Saturday from an owner (can't recall his name). The Intel (gas) smartcar was there advertising WiMax next to our display. We were behind Solarworld and PGE green power booths in the center of the civic center plaza. Gary ________________________________ From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of patrick0101 at gmail.com Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 10:48 PM To: OEVA Subject: [Oeva-list] Hillsboro Mainsteet Madness Did anyone from OEVA attend the Hillsboro Mainstreet Madness event last weekend? http://www.mainstreetmadness.org/ A friend of mine went and said that they had EVs on display including a Zap Xebra, another 3-wheeler, and a Honda Civic conversion. At first I assumed that the display must have been MCEV or EcoMotion, then when he said there was a conversion, I was puzzled. Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080805/02644a0b/attachment-0001.html From nevokyay at yahoo.com Tue Aug 5 16:41:37 2008 From: nevokyay at yahoo.com (Nev Okyay) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 16:41:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] rear wheel drive only? Message-ID: <797151.7637.qm@web55108.mail.re4.yahoo.com> The message below was rejected, I am trying to send it again (after I joined the eva list). > > Hi - > > I am new to this list. I am planning on converting > a small car to EV. > > When I talked to the mechanic about taking the > engine > out, he told me that the car had to be > rear-wheel-drive. > He is saying that if you take the engine out of a > front wheel drive car, since the transmission and > the > clutch is built into the engine, they all will come > out together. There won't be any way to hook up the > electric motor to it (unless of course straight to > the wheels directly?). > > Is this true? Only the rear wheel drive cars can be > converted to EV? > > thanks for any info on this.. > > > From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Tue Aug 5 16:55:32 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 16:55:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] rear wheel drive only? Message-ID: <638835.53404.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi Nev, I believe the mechanic's statement is false. I'm currently converting a Honda Civic which has front wheel drive and others have converted Saturns which are also front wheel drive. For me, the the process was to remove the whole engine/tranny assembly from the car and then detach the engine from the transmission. By bolting the electric motor on (with adapter plate) outside the car, it's easier to re-install the assembly as a whole instead of trying to install the motor with the transmission still in the car. You can see pictures of this if you look at all the entries at http://civic-ev.blogspot.com Cheers, Tim Kutscha OEVA Chair ----- Original Message ---- From: Nev Okyay To: oeva-list at oeva.org Sent: Tuesday, August 5, 2008 4:41:37 PM Subject: [Oeva-list] rear wheel drive only? The message below was rejected, I am trying to send it again (after I joined the eva list). > > Hi - > > I am new to this list. I am planning on converting > a small car to EV. > > When I talked to the mechanic about taking the > engine > out, he told me that the car had to be > rear-wheel-drive. > He is saying that if you take the engine out of a > front wheel drive car, since the transmission and > the > clutch is built into the engine, they all will come > out together. There won't be any way to hook up the > electric motor to it (unless of course straight to > the wheels directly?). > > Is this true? Only the rear wheel drive cars can be > converted to EV? > > thanks for any info on this.. > > > _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080805/bf546305/attachment.html From nevokyay at yahoo.com Tue Aug 5 22:17:06 2008 From: nevokyay at yahoo.com (Nev Okyay) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 22:17:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] rear wheel drive only? In-Reply-To: <638835.53404.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48045.95754.qm@web55106.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Hi Tim- I am reading through your blog. Lots of detailed info. Thank You! - nev --- Tim Kutscha wrote: > Hi Nev, > > I believe the mechanic's statement is false. I'm > currently converting a Honda Civic which has front > wheel drive and others have converted Saturns which > are also front wheel drive. > For me, the the process was to remove the whole > engine/tranny assembly from the car and then > detach the engine from the transmission. By bolting > the electric motor on (with adapter plate) outside > the > car, it's easier to re-install the assembly as a > whole > instead of trying to install the motor with the > transmission > still in the car. > You can see pictures of this if you look at all > the > entries at http://civic-ev.blogspot.com > > Cheers, > Tim Kutscha > OEVA Chair > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Nev Okyay > To: oeva-list at oeva.org > Sent: Tuesday, August 5, 2008 4:41:37 PM > Subject: [Oeva-list] rear wheel drive only? > > The message below was rejected, I am trying to send > it again (after I joined the eva list). > > > > > Hi - > > > > I am new to this list. I am planning on > converting > > a small car to EV. > > > > When I talked to the mechanic about taking the > > engine > > out, he told me that the car had to be > > rear-wheel-drive. > > He is saying that if you take the engine out of a > > front wheel drive car, since the transmission and > > the > > clutch is built into the engine, they all will > come > > out together. There won't be any way to hook up > the > > electric motor to it (unless of course straight to > > the wheels directly?). > > > > Is this true? Only the rear wheel drive cars can > be > > converted to EV? > > > > thanks for any info on this.. > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > > > From patrick0101 at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 00:33:06 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 00:33:06 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] LEVA Trip Report Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808060033n3036b11fgeef35d181288cd64@mail.gmail.com> Went up to the Longview EV clubs meeting tonight and presented the "Upcoming OEM EVs" presentation that I gave at the OEVA July meeting. Thanks for inviting me Wade. There was one question that stumped me, "What was the wind powered car that was recently announced?" I had not heard about it and immediately had visions of a sail powered car. A little searching and here is what I found: Lotus is installing wind turbines to be sited inside the test track at the Lotus's factory. The title of the article is misleading. Wind Powered cars are on the way! That should be "*Wind Powered Car production on the way" *There was an interesting spontaneous nuclear power discussion during the meeting too. * * Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080806/757490df/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 00:39:24 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 00:39:24 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Zero X Offroad EV Motorcycle Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808060039p63f9504cocdfece81ec7fcfa8@mail.gmail.com> http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/zero-x.php Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080806/bed5ff44/attachment.html From rmerwin at aracnet.com Wed Aug 6 06:11:45 2008 From: rmerwin at aracnet.com (Ralph Merwin) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 06:11:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] rear wheel drive only? In-Reply-To: <797151.7637.qm@web55108.mail.re4.yahoo.com> from "Nev Okyay" at Aug 05, 2008 04:41:37 PM Message-ID: <200808061311.m76DBj9w010256@onyx.spiritone.com> Your mechanic may be thinking of a specific car. Which car are you thinking of converting? There are many examples of front-wheel-drive vehicles being converted to electric. As long as the transmission can be unbolted from the engine, you should be able to make an adaptor plate to mate the electric motor to the transmission. The flywheel and clutch would still reside in the transmission's bell housing. Look at the hundreds of vehicles listed on the EVDL Photo Album http://www.evalbum.com/ Many of these are front-wheel-drive. Ralph Nev Okyay writes: > > > When I talked to the mechanic about taking the > > engine > > out, he told me that the car had to be > > rear-wheel-drive. > > He is saying that if you take the engine out of a > > front wheel drive car, since the transmission and > > the > > clutch is built into the engine, they all will come > > out together. There won't be any way to hook up the > > electric motor to it (unless of course straight to > > the wheels directly?). > > > > Is this true? Only the rear wheel drive cars can be > > converted to EV? From Todd at toddsimport.com Wed Aug 6 12:14:45 2008 From: Todd at toddsimport.com (Todd Weedman) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 12:14:45 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Tonight: Hybrid, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicle Education Class Message-ID: <004801c8f7f8$b1abb730$0701a8c0@backoffice> Hello everyone, Just a reminder that tonight we are having a class for the general public to educate them about the benefits and pitfalls of current and emerging vehicle technologies. Our specific focus is on Hybrids, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicles The class is free and anyone with an interest is encouraged to attend. Please call if you have any questions. Todd Weedman, owner Todd's Import Automotive 17607 Pilkington Rd Lake Oswego OR 97035 503-635-1339 Todd at ToddsImport.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080806/d21f2a62/attachment.html From Todd at toddsimport.com Wed Aug 6 12:14:45 2008 From: Todd at toddsimport.com (Todd Weedman) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 12:14:45 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Tonight: Hybrid, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicle Education Class Message-ID: <004801c8f7f8$b1abb730$0701a8c0@backoffice> Hello everyone, Just a reminder that tonight we are having a class for the general public to educate them about the benefits and pitfalls of current and emerging vehicle technologies. Our specific focus is on Hybrids, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicles The class is free and anyone with an interest is encouraged to attend. Please call if you have any questions. Todd Weedman, owner Todd's Import Automotive 17607 Pilkington Rd Lake Oswego OR 97035 503-635-1339 Todd at ToddsImport.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080806/d21f2a62/attachment-0001.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 13:33:07 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 13:33:07 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Tonight: Hybrid, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicle Education Class In-Reply-To: <004801c8f7f8$b1abb730$0701a8c0@backoffice> References: <004801c8f7f8$b1abb730$0701a8c0@backoffice> Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808061333y7cf99354paefb841f84029300@mail.gmail.com> What time and location? And do you have any materials you can share on this list? On Wed, Aug 6, 2008 at 12:14 PM, Todd Weedman wrote: > Hello everyone, > > Just a reminder that tonight we are having a class for the general public > to educate > them about the benefits and pitfalls of current and emerging vehicle > technologies. > > Our specific focus is on Hybrids, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicles > The class is free and anyone with an interest is encouraged to attend. > > Please call if you have any questions. > > Todd Weedman, owner > Todd's Import Automotive > 17607 Pilkington Rd > Lake Oswego OR 97035 > 503-635-1339 > Todd at ToddsImport.com > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080806/d9467833/attachment.html From jktmillar at canby.com Wed Aug 6 14:57:21 2008 From: jktmillar at canby.com (jktmillar at canby.com) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 14:57:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Tonight: Hybrid, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicle Education Class In-Reply-To: <8c28d7b50808061333y7cf99354paefb841f84029300@mail.gmail.com> References: <004801c8f7f8$b1abb730$0701a8c0@backoffice> <8c28d7b50808061333y7cf99354paefb841f84029300@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1623.71.237.140.201.1218059841.squirrel@mail.web-ster.com> > Todd's Import Automotive 17607 Pilkington Rd Lake Oswego OR 97035 503-635-1339 7:00 pm What time and location? And do you have any materials you can share on > this > list? > > On Wed, Aug 6, 2008 at 12:14 PM, Todd Weedman > wrote: > >> Hello everyone, >> >> Just a reminder that tonight we are having a class for the general >> public >> to educate >> them about the benefits and pitfalls of current and emerging vehicle >> technologies. >> >> Our specific focus is on Hybrids, Alternative Fuel and Electric Vehicles >> The class is free and anyone with an interest is encouraged to attend. >> >> Please call if you have any questions. >> >> Todd Weedman, owner >> Todd's Import Automotive >> 17607 Pilkington Rd >> Lake Oswego OR 97035 >> 503-635-1339 >> Todd at ToddsImport.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Oeva-list mailing list >> Oeva-list at oeva.org >> http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list >> >> > > > -- > Regards, > Pat > Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > From glassphoto at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 16:30:58 2008 From: glassphoto at gmail.com (Micheal Drewry) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 16:30:58 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] rear wheel drive only? In-Reply-To: <797151.7637.qm@web55108.mail.re4.yahoo.com> References: <797151.7637.qm@web55108.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43e1e6a70808061630s40b3df3ax5abf929100cb5fd8@mail.gmail.com> I converted a front wheel drive Saturn and never did take out the transmission. Just unbolted the motor, lifted it out, then hooked the adapter plate and flywheel to the electric motor and lowered it into place and bolted it back together. On the Saturn there was enough room to do that and it seemed simpler. Mike http://www.evalbum.com/1371 On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 4:41 PM, Nev Okyay wrote: > The message below was rejected, I am trying to send > it again (after I joined the eva list). > > > > > Hi - > > > > I am new to this list. I am planning on converting > > a small car to EV. > > > > When I talked to the mechanic about taking the > > engine > > out, he told me that the car had to be > > rear-wheel-drive. > > He is saying that if you take the engine out of a > > front wheel drive car, since the transmission and > > the > > clutch is built into the engine, they all will come > > out together. There won't be any way to hook up the > > electric motor to it (unless of course straight to > > the wheels directly?). > > > > Is this true? Only the rear wheel drive cars can be > > converted to EV? > > > > thanks for any info on this.. > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080806/ddd00adb/attachment.html From matt.killinger at gmail.com Fri Aug 8 17:30:24 2008 From: matt.killinger at gmail.com (Matt Killinger) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 17:30:24 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] BugE owner in Portland Metro area willing to talk to prospective buyer? Message-ID: <68d872480808081730w51f2be75qd499d863a2dcd66c@mail.gmail.com> I'm interested in finding owners of the BugE vehicle that live in the Portland Metro area and who would be willing to talk to a prospective buyer concerning their experience with their BugE. I spoke with Mark Murphy one year ago at the OEVA Awareness event in Pioneer Square and was impressed with the aesthetic and apparently practical solution for short distance commuters that he has created with the BugE but was hoping to get some alternate perspectives to those who have actually assembled a kit and who have driven one of these vehicles. In particular I'm interested in knowing: - The quality of the components provided in the kit - The durability of the kit components over time - Difficulty of assembly - Time to assemble - Any unexpected costs - Ability to upgrade components over time as technology has improved - Usability of the vehicle throughout the year (inclement weather viability in particular) Thanks! Matt -- Matt Killinger Semper Fi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080808/306c21c9/attachment.html From java at xprt.net Fri Aug 8 18:00:23 2008 From: java at xprt.net (Steve Boser) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 18:00:23 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Is there any companies in Portland selling EV Parts? Message-ID: <489cec27.46bb.0@xprt.net> Hi all I'm working on an electric bike and I need a 5k throttle (I would like a Magura twist throttle). I can purchase one on the net, but would prefer to buy locally. Anyone know of a company here in the Portland area that sells EV parts retail? Thank you Steve Boser From patrick0101 at gmail.com Fri Aug 8 20:42:16 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 20:42:16 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Kelley Blue Book Green Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808082042o4a07d285tcd04967396dc9d77@mail.gmail.com> KBB has launched a new green page. You can select your alt-fuel choice in the top right corner. http://www.kbb.com/kbb/green-cars/electric-cars.aspx Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080808/3001a7b2/attachment.html From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Mon Aug 11 08:46:37 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 08:46:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] OEVA meeting this Thursday, August 14th, 7pm Message-ID: <602900.6413.qm@web36907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hello OEVA folks, It's time for another monthly meeting this coming Thursday, August 14th. Everyone, member or not, is welcome to attend our meetings. We'll gather as usual at 7:00PM for show-and-tell of EVs and start the meeting at 7:30PM. We meet at Two World Trade Center at 1st and Salmon in SW Portland. The courtyard will be open to display vehicles and provide some charging. The street-side charging will also be available just across 1st Ave. Agenda for the general meeting: 7:30 - Welcome new people (info: bathrooms, membership dues, T-shirts, flyers, e-mail list) - Announcements (Call to CLEAN action poll) - Past EVents (Plug-In Conference, Meeting of the Minds, Hillsboro event) - Upcoming EVents (Alternative Energy Show, EV awareness day 2009) - Updates on member EVs - Break into subgroups (charging, newcomers, small business group, awareness day group) 9:00 - End the meeting so we can get home or look at EVs I've been receiving many requests from people asking about local businesses that either sell EV parts or do conversions. There have also been people who are interested in starting a small conversion business. I'd like to try starting a new sub-group this month regarding "EV small businesses" where people can work together and mentor each other on their EV business. We'll try this for a few months and see if it meets the needs of the members and the local community. Please feel free to bring information, questions and vehicles! Again, non-OEVA-members are more than welcome! Cheers, Tim Kutscha OEVA Chair -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080811/b829912a/attachment.html From Doug at chernofflaw.com Mon Aug 11 12:35:18 2008 From: Doug at chernofflaw.com (Doug Wells) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 12:35:18 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] BugE owner in Portland Metro area willing to talk toprospective buyer? In-Reply-To: <68d872480808081730w51f2be75qd499d863a2dcd66c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <39AE012CC9226948B2F05151A750B7CA1268AE@cvms-exchange.chernofflaw.local> Matt, I forwarded your inquiry to Mark on Friday, figuring he'd have suggestions... His response: [], you could refer him to the BugE_list/subscribe at yahoogroups.com its a forum for BugE owners and enthusiasts. It is independently run. It is on our links page of the www.BugEv.net website. Mark BSD [] ++++ Hope this helps. -Doug J. Douglas Wells, Esq. Chernoff, Vilhauer, McClung & Stenzel, LLP 1600 ODS Tower 601 SW Second Avenue Portland, Oregon 97204-3157 ph: 503-227-5631 fax: 503-228-4373 Email: doug at chernofflaw.com CONFIDENTIALITY STATEMENT This electronic message transmission contains information from Chernoff, Vilhauer, McClung & Stenzel, LLP. It is protected by the attorney/client privilege. If it has been sent to you in error, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this transmission is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify us by telephone (503-227-5631), and then delete this message without copying it. Thank You! ________________________________ From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of Matt Killinger Sent: Friday, August 08, 2008 5:30 PM To: Oeva-list at oeva.org Subject: [Oeva-list] BugE owner in Portland Metro area willing to talk toprospective buyer? I'm interested in finding owners of the BugE vehicle that live in the Portland Metro area and who would be willing to talk to a prospective buyer concerning their experience with their BugE. I spoke with Mark Murphy one year ago at the OEVA Awareness event in Pioneer Square and was impressed with the aesthetic and apparently practical solution for short distance commuters that he has created with the BugE but was hoping to get some alternate perspectives to those who have actually assembled a kit and who have driven one of these vehicles. In particular I'm interested in knowing: - The quality of the components provided in the kit - The durability of the kit components over time - Difficulty of assembly - Time to assemble - Any unexpected costs - Ability to upgrade components over time as technology has improved - Usability of the vehicle throughout the year (inclement weather viability in particular) Thanks! Matt -- Matt Killinger Semper Fi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080811/a847118a/attachment.html From william.norris-york at intel.com Mon Aug 11 13:10:18 2008 From: william.norris-york at intel.com (Norris-York, William) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 13:10:18 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Local EV motor companies Message-ID: <9D39833986E69849A2A8E74C1078B6B3D23EF0@orsmsx415.amr.corp.intel.com> Hi all, are there any local companies that make EV motors? The backlog at NetGain is putting a crimp in my schedule :-) Thanks, Bill -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080811/c7aaae00/attachment.html From javabrewery at yahoo.com Mon Aug 11 16:55:42 2008 From: javabrewery at yahoo.com (Sonny N.) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 16:55:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Oeva-list Digest, Vol 58, Issue 12 Message-ID: <854045.15475.qm@web84305.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Tim, I think it is a great idea to start a sub-group "EV small businesses" to focus on EV business opportunities in the Portland metro area. By the way, Seattle EV association (http://www.seattleeva.org/wiki/Main_Page) started a forum and they are talking about exactly a similar thing, like starting a co-op or something similar to help get more cars converted to EV.? Here is the link to the thread: http://www.seattleeva.org/smf/index.php/topic,12.0.html I would love to hear if anyone in the group would like to form a co-op to help each other fulfill their drEVm. Thanks. Sonny ----- Original Message ---- From: "oeva-list-request at oeva.org" To: oeva-list at oeva.org Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 12:00:07 PM Subject: Oeva-list Digest, Vol 58, Issue 12 Send Oeva-list mailing list submissions to ??? oeva-list at oeva.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? oeva-list-request at oeva.org You can reach the person managing the list at ??? oeva-list-owner at oeva.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Oeva-list digest..." Today's Topics: ? 1. OEVA meeting this Thursday, August 14th, 7pm (Tim Kutscha) -----Inline Message Follows----- Hello OEVA folks, It's time for another monthly meeting this coming Thursday, August 14th.? Everyone, member or not, is welcome to attend our meetings.? We'll gather as usual at 7:00PM for show-and-tell of EVs and start the meeting at 7:30PM. We meet at Two World Trade Center at 1st and Salmon in SW Portland. The courtyard will be open to display vehicles and provide some charging. The street-side charging will also be available just across 1st Ave. Agenda for the general meeting: 7:30 - Welcome new people (info: bathrooms, membership dues, T-shirts, flyers, e-mail list) - Announcements (Call to CLEAN action poll) - Past EVents (Plug-In Conference, Meeting of the Minds, Hillsboro event) - Upcoming EVents (Alternative Energy Show, EV awareness day 2009) - Updates on member EVs - Break into subgroups (charging, newcomers, small business group, awareness day group) 9:00 - End the meeting so we can get home or look at EVs I've been receiving many requests from people asking about local businesses that? either sell EV parts or do conversions.? There have also been people who are interested in starting a small conversion business.? I'd like to try starting a new sub-group this month regarding "EV small businesses" where people can work together and mentor each other on their EV business.? We'll try this for a few months and see if it meets the needs of the members and the local community. Please feel free to bring information, questions and vehicles! Again, non-OEVA-members are more than welcome! Cheers, Tim Kutscha OEVA Chair _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080811/12a2d4bb/attachment-0001.html From glassphoto at gmail.com Tue Aug 12 09:23:52 2008 From: glassphoto at gmail.com (Micheal Drewry) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 09:23:52 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Fast charger? Message-ID: <43e1e6a70808120923i233c0098s9f030ebe37017022@mail.gmail.com> http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUST33634020080807 ... " TEPCO, Japan's largest utility, has developed a device that powers an electric car to run 40 km (25 miles) after a five-minute charge and 60 km (37 miles) after a 10-minute charge, the Nikkei said." Anyone hear of a device/method that can charge batteries so fast? I wonder what types of batteries will be in the cars that are to be charged by these chargers. Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080812/99835642/attachment.html From tony at notebene.net Tue Aug 12 09:58:11 2008 From: tony at notebene.net (Tony McCormick) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 09:58:11 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Fast charger? In-Reply-To: <43e1e6a70808120923i233c0098s9f030ebe37017022@mail.gmail.com> References: <43e1e6a70808120923i233c0098s9f030ebe37017022@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48A1C123.5070303@notebene.net> In simple terms it's just how many amps can you pull from the wall and put in the batteries. "dump charging" from a charged DC pack to discharged pack is done at very high amps on the EV drag strip frequently.... big fat cables and connectors .... --Tony Micheal Drewry wrote: > http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUST33634020080807 > > ... > " TEPCO, Japan's largest utility, has developed a device that powers > an electric car to run 40 km (25 miles) after a five-minute charge and > 60 km (37 miles) after a 10-minute charge, the Nikkei said." > > Anyone hear of a device/method that can charge batteries so fast? I > wonder what types of batteries will be in the cars that are to be > charged by these chargers. > > Mike > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > -- Tony McCormick -------------------------------- http://www.notebene.net & http://www.backporchrevival.com From gary.graunke at intel.com Tue Aug 12 10:12:06 2008 From: gary.graunke at intel.com (Graunke, Gary) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:12:06 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Fast charger? In-Reply-To: <43e1e6a70808120923i233c0098s9f030ebe37017022@mail.gmail.com> References: <43e1e6a70808120923i233c0098s9f030ebe37017022@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: If you have high power batteries that can discharge quickly, you can generally charge them quickly as well. The a123 systems batteries that I use and John Wayland used to set his record at PIR specify a 15-minute fast charge. For my car, that would mean a 40KW charger, or 240V at 200A, about the same electrical service as my house. The lack of fast charging is not really the problem-the way to do this is to change the batteries quickly just like you do with a propane tank. You get a new tank-you do not refill the tank. Project Better Place is doing this-you rent the batteries that are fully charged and exchange them to fill up. Miles 1920's car has a tray so that you can change the batteries quickly. So the solution is to redesign the vehicle to be able to swap battery packs very quickly. In the meantime, most of us simply need a bigger charger (10 to 20 KW) and electric service to match for a quick charge. One could also imagine a charging station that did direct DC to the batteries (charger in the charging station). This would take standardizing the communication protocol between the car/BMS and the charger to select the correct voltages and charging profile. The charger would then in essence be a "dump charger". One could use a 350A anderson connector and auxiliary communication connector/wireless, or design a new connector with both. Gary ________________________________ From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of Micheal Drewry Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 9:24 AM To: OEVA Subject: [Oeva-list] Fast charger? http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUST33634020080807 ... " TEPCO, Japan's largest utility, has developed a device that powers an electric car to run 40 km (25 miles) after a five-minute charge and 60 km (37 miles) after a 10-minute charge, the Nikkei said." Anyone hear of a device/method that can charge batteries so fast? I wonder what types of batteries will be in the cars that are to be charged by these chargers. Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080812/8a0cf4fc/attachment.html From tony at notebene.net Tue Aug 12 10:20:35 2008 From: tony at notebene.net (Tony McCormick) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:20:35 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] why do all the production EVs go to california Message-ID: <48A1C663.9050204@notebene.net> I keep reading announcements of auto manufacturers preparing to send EV's to California (BMW and Mitsibishi, recently). What does it take to let the world know that Oregon is a good place to send EV's, doesn't the most Prius' on the road mean anything? Does our state government need to do something more? Is it all just left over from the ZEV mandates of the 90s? -- Tony McCormick -------------------------------- http://www.notebene.net & http://www.backporchrevival.com From gary.graunke at intel.com Tue Aug 12 10:31:25 2008 From: gary.graunke at intel.com (Graunke, Gary) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:31:25 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] why do all the production EVs go to california In-Reply-To: <48A1C663.9050204@notebene.net> References: <48A1C663.9050204@notebene.net> Message-ID: I recently heard that every EV made in a ZEV state is worth thousands of $ to its maker. They can also sell these credits to laggard automakers that need them to meet their ZEV targets. In the same meeting, Oregon was mentioned as NOT being one of those states. When we adopted California's car standards as part of the Governor's clean cars initiative, I thought that we included the ZEV portion (that certainly was our recommendation!). But apparently we don't have requirements or credits. Since the company I met with is in the EV business, I expect they are right about the credits or lack thereof. I have not yet followed up on why Oregon is not one of those states. Gary -----Original Message----- From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of Tony McCormick Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 10:21 AM To: OEVA Subject: [Oeva-list] why do all the production EVs go to california I keep reading announcements of auto manufacturers preparing to send EV's to California (BMW and Mitsibishi, recently). What does it take to let the world know that Oregon is a good place to send EV's, doesn't the most Prius' on the road mean anything? Does our state government need to do something more? Is it all just left over from the ZEV mandates of the 90s? -- Tony McCormick -------------------------------- http://www.notebene.net & http://www.backporchrevival.com _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list From rmerwin at aracnet.com Tue Aug 12 12:22:53 2008 From: rmerwin at aracnet.com (Ralph Merwin) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 12:22:53 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Fast charger? In-Reply-To: from "Graunke, Gary" at Aug 12, 2008 10:12:06 AM Message-ID: <200808121922.m7CJMswd013268@onyx.spiritone.com> AGM batteries such as Optimas can handle whatever currents you supply, ***>> as long as you carefully monitor battery voltage and don't <<*** ***>> exceed the specified voltage limit or temperature limit. <<*** Ditto for NiCads, and probably NiMH and the various lithium cells. Fast charging, as Gary points out, requires very large currents. Fast charging is also not intended for complete charging, but rather just to about the 80% level so you can get going again. Perfect for delivery drivers, mostly not applicable to us worker-bees that commute to work and back. When using fast charging, the vehicle will need a proper (slow) charge at some point to bring the pack up to full charge, typically done at the end of the work day. There are standards already defined for fast charging, contained in SAE J1772 (conductive coupled charging). It defines Level 1 charging, Level 2 charging and DC charging (aka Level 3 charging). Level 1 is the standard 120v outlet. Level 2 is 240V at 40 amps (such as the Avcon system). DC Charging is up to 600VDC and up to 400 amps. AC Propulsion has proposed a Level 2+ that allows higher currents than Level 2. SAE J1773 addresses inductive coupled charging. Ralph Graunke, Gary writes: > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > --===============0046912117== > Content-class: urn:content-classes:message > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C8FC9E.8C5AA54A" > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8FC9E.8C5AA54A > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > If you have high power batteries that can discharge quickly, you can > generally charge them quickly as well.=20 > > =20 > > The a123 systems batteries that I use and John Wayland used to set his > record at PIR specify a 15-minute fast charge.=20 > > For my car, that would mean a 40KW charger, or 240V at 200A, about the > same electrical service as my house.=20 > > =20 > > The lack of fast charging is not really the problem-the way to do this > is to change the batteries quickly just like you do with a propane tank. > You get a new tank-you do not refill the tank. Project Better Place is > doing this-you rent the batteries that are fully charged and exchange > them to fill up. Miles 1920's car has a tray so that you can change the > batteries quickly.=20 > > =20 > > So the solution is to redesign the vehicle to be able to swap battery > packs very quickly.=20 > > =20 > > In the meantime, most of us simply need a bigger charger (10 to 20 KW) > and electric service to match for a quick charge. =20 > > =20 > > One could also imagine a charging station that did direct DC to the > batteries (charger in the charging station). This would take > standardizing the communication protocol between the car/BMS and the > charger to select the correct voltages and charging profile. The charger > would then in essence be a "dump charger". One could use a 350A anderson > connector and auxiliary communication connector/wireless, or design a > new connector with both. > > =20 > > Gary > > =20 > > ________________________________ > > From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On > Behalf Of Micheal Drewry > Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 9:24 AM > To: OEVA > Subject: [Oeva-list] Fast charger? > > =20 > > http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUST33634020080807 > > ... > " TEPCO, Japan's largest utility, has developed a device that powers an > electric car to run 40 km (25 miles) after a five-minute charge and 60 > km (37 miles) after a 10-minute charge, the Nikkei said." > > Anyone hear of a device/method that can charge batteries so fast? I > wonder what types of batteries will be in the cars that are to be > charged by these chargers. > > Mike > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8FC9E.8C5AA54A > Content-Type: text/html; > charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" = > xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" = > xmlns:st1=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" = > xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> > > > charset=3Dus-ascii"> > > namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" = > name=3D"City"/> > namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" > name=3D"place"/> > namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" > name=3D"Street"/> > namespaceuri=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" > name=3D"address"/> > > > > > > > >
> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>If you have high power batteries = > that can > discharge quickly, you can generally charge them quickly as well. = >

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The a123 systems batteries that I = > use and > John Wayland used to set his record at PIR specify a 15-minute fast = > charge.

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>For my car, that would mean a 40KW > charger, or 240V at 200A, about the same electrical service as my house. = >

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The lack of fast charging is not = > really > the problem—the way to do this is to change the batteries quickly = > just > like you do with a propane tank. You get a new tank—you do not = > refill the > tank. Project Better = > Place > is doing this—you rent the batteries that are fully charged and = > exchange > them to fill up. Miles 1920’s car has a tray so that you can = > change the > batteries quickly.

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>So the solution is to redesign the = > vehicle > to be able to swap battery packs very quickly. = >

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>In the meantime, most of us simply = > need a > bigger charger (10 to 20 KW) and electric service to match for a quick = > charge.  

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>One could also imagine a charging = > station > that did direct DC to the batteries (charger in the charging station). = > This > would take standardizing the communication protocol between the car/BMS = > and the > charger to select the correct voltages and charging profile. The charger = > would > then in essence be a “dump charger”. One could use a 350A = > w:st=3D"on">anderson = > connector and > auxiliary communication connector/wireless, or design a new connector = > with > both.

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

> >

size=3D2 > color=3Dnavy face=3DArial> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial; > color:navy'>Gary color=3Dnavy > face=3DArial> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> >

> >

style=3D'font-size: > 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

> >
> >
size=3D3 > face=3D"Times New Roman"> > >
> >
> >

style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From: size=3D2 > face=3DTahoma> > oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of Micheal Drewry
> Sent: Tuesday, August 12, = > 2008 > 9:24 AM
> To: OEVA
> Subject: [Oeva-list] Fast = > charger?

> >
> >

style=3D'font-size: > 12.0pt'> 

> >
> >

style=3D'font-size: > 12.0pt'> href=3D"http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUST3363402008080= > 7">http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUST33634020080807= >
>
> ...
> " TEPCO, Japan's largest utility, has developed a device that = > powers an electric > car to run 40 km (25 miles) after a five-minute charge and 60 km (37 = > miles) > after a 10-minute charge, the Nikkei said."
>
> Anyone hear of a device/method that can charge batteries so = > fast?   I > wonder what types of batteries will be in the cars that are to be = > charged by > these chargers.
>
> Mike

> >
> >
> > > > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8FC9E.8C5AA54A-- > > --===============0046912117== > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > --===============0046912117==-- > From dabrown at ieee.org Tue Aug 12 20:58:27 2008 From: dabrown at ieee.org (Dan Brown) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 20:58:27 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Suggestions for emergency toolkit In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001e01c8fcf8$d7a8c4f0$86fa4ed0$@org> I'm putting together an emergency roadside toolkit to hopefully cover minor problems encountered on the road that I could overcome with the right tools. I'm not too concerned with weight issues; more interested in the best bang for the buck in quickly fixing typical breakdowns. So far, I have: 1. wrenches 2. sockets/drive 3. pliers 4. extra battery cable (to jump over a dead battery) 5. spare fuses 6. wire & wire cutter 7. extension cord What would you suggest I add? Is there anything listed that I really don't need? Thanks, Dan Beaverton 1980 Bradley (nee 1968 VW) From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Tue Aug 12 21:36:37 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 21:36:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Suggestions for emergency toolkit Message-ID: <165882.59045.qm@web36903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi Dan, Here's the emergency toolkit I assembled for the 914: http://914ev.blogspot.com/2007/08/ev-toolbox.html Cheers, Tim OEVA Chair ----- Original Message ---- From: Dan Brown To: oeva-list at oeva.org Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 8:58:27 PM Subject: [Oeva-list] Suggestions for emergency toolkit I'm putting together an emergency roadside toolkit to hopefully cover minor problems encountered on the road that I could overcome with the right tools. I'm not too concerned with weight issues; more interested in the best bang for the buck in quickly fixing typical breakdowns. So far, I have: 1. wrenches 2. sockets/drive 3. pliers 4. extra battery cable (to jump over a dead battery) 5. spare fuses 6. wire & wire cutter 7. extension cord What would you suggest I add? Is there anything listed that I really don't need? Thanks, Dan Beaverton 1980 Bradley (nee 1968 VW) _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080812/5f46fd60/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Tue Aug 12 21:51:54 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 21:51:54 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Suggestions for emergency toolkit In-Reply-To: <001e01c8fcf8$d7a8c4f0$86fa4ed0$@org> References: <001e01c8fcf8$d7a8c4f0$86fa4ed0$@org> Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808122151w62f41a6sdb00ee4fb3f2b9c6@mail.gmail.com> a cell phone & a AAA card. On Tue, Aug 12, 2008 at 8:58 PM, Dan Brown wrote: > I'm putting together an emergency roadside toolkit to hopefully > cover minor problems encountered on the road that I could > overcome with the right tools. I'm not too concerned with weight > issues; more interested in the best bang for the buck in quickly > fixing typical breakdowns. > > So far, I have: > 1. wrenches > 2. sockets/drive > 3. pliers > 4. extra battery cable (to jump over a dead battery) > 5. spare fuses > 6. wire & wire cutter > 7. extension cord > > What would you suggest I add? Is there anything listed that I > really don't need? > > Thanks, > Dan > Beaverton > 1980 Bradley (nee 1968 VW) > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080812/dfaf53d3/attachment.html From matwete at comcast.net Tue Aug 12 22:09:59 2008 From: matwete at comcast.net (Myles Twete) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 22:09:59 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Suggestions for emergency toolkit In-Reply-To: <8c28d7b50808122151w62f41a6sdb00ee4fb3f2b9c6@mail.gmail.com> References: <001e01c8fcf8$d7a8c4f0$86fa4ed0$@org> <8c28d7b50808122151w62f41a6sdb00ee4fb3f2b9c6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <005701c8fd02$d60edf80$822c9e80$@net> Flares.hazard lamp, jack. From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of patrick0101 at gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 9:52 PM To: dabrown at ieee.org Cc: oeva-list at oeva.org Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] Suggestions for emergency toolkit a cell phone & a AAA card. On Tue, Aug 12, 2008 at 8:58 PM, Dan Brown wrote: I'm putting together an emergency roadside toolkit to hopefully cover minor problems encountered on the road that I could overcome with the right tools. I'm not too concerned with weight issues; more interested in the best bang for the buck in quickly fixing typical breakdowns. So far, I have: 1. wrenches 2. sockets/drive 3. pliers 4. extra battery cable (to jump over a dead battery) 5. spare fuses 6. wire & wire cutter 7. extension cord What would you suggest I add? Is there anything listed that I really don't need? Thanks, Dan Beaverton 1980 Bradley (nee 1968 VW) _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080812/7916b349/attachment-0001.html From rmerwin at aracnet.com Wed Aug 13 05:59:10 2008 From: rmerwin at aracnet.com (Ralph Merwin) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 05:59:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Suggestions for emergency toolkit In-Reply-To: <001e01c8fcf8$d7a8c4f0$86fa4ed0$@org> from "Dan Brown" at Aug 12, 2008 08:58:27 PM Message-ID: <200808131259.m7DCxAAl004831@onyx.spiritone.com> Dan, For your item "wrenches", I carried a pair of combination wrenches with taped handles, for battery terminals, and another one that fit the larger nuts on the box-interconnect terminals. I alo carried a small crescent wrench with the handle taped. For "spare fuses", I carried extras for every fuse in the car. I didn't carry any sockets. Otherwise, to your list I'd add: - Whatever tools are required to access your batteries. In my case, this was a small T-handled hex wrench for the box cover screws. - A roll of electrical tape - A collection of crimp-on terminals and a crimper - One of those 4-in-one screwdrivers - A few small and large zip ties Ralph Dan Brown writes: > > I'm putting together an emergency roadside toolkit to hopefully > cover minor problems encountered on the road that I could > overcome with the right tools. I'm not too concerned with weight > issues; more interested in the best bang for the buck in quickly > fixing typical breakdowns. > > So far, I have: > 1. wrenches > 2. sockets/drive > 3. pliers > 4. extra battery cable (to jump over a dead battery) > 5. spare fuses > 6. wire & wire cutter > 7. extension cord > > What would you suggest I add? Is there anything listed that I > really don't need? > > Thanks, > Dan > Beaverton > 1980 Bradley (nee 1968 VW) > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > From mike at mapclicks.com Wed Aug 13 17:28:53 2008 From: mike at mapclicks.com (Michael Sant) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 17:28:53 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Fwd: Electric car pioneer looks to Portland for N. American toehold References: <87EDAF8E-366E-43FC-8918-25A1874EA066@gmail.com> Message-ID: <70DBE3BE-618E-4EC8-8E92-B78352CA435A@mapclicks.com> http://www.portlandtribune.com/news/story.php?story_id=121866762770073600 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080813/22333279/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 01:34:11 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 01:34:11 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Too Good to be True Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808140134l332ad2f3g4da4aeb53d20d737@mail.gmail.com> Hype Alert http://www.foshelectricauto.com/ "first unlimited mileage, electric car... revolutionary, self-regenerating battery system" Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080814/64aba5b2/attachment.html From glassphoto at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 14:15:59 2008 From: glassphoto at gmail.com (Micheal Drewry) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 14:15:59 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation Message-ID: <43e1e6a70808141415q6373f25ch2918f842a656de91@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, I just heard from EV Parts my PFC-20 is shipping next week. This is the replacement for my failed Russco charger. Quick question for anyone who has installed one of these before. Does it come with the Anderson connectors I need? My current charger uses a very small connector on 14 gage wire and it looks like the ones coming out of the PFC are on very thick wires that look close to the size of wire I'm using between the batteries. Also, any other issues I need to be aware of? Any advice greatly appreciated. Thanks all! Mike Drewry http://www.evalbum.com/1371 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080814/01ff55cb/attachment.html From gary.graunke at intel.com Thu Aug 14 14:40:18 2008 From: gary.graunke at intel.com (Graunke, Gary) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 14:40:18 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation In-Reply-To: <43e1e6a70808141415q6373f25ch2918f842a656de91@mail.gmail.com> References: <43e1e6a70808141415q6373f25ch2918f842a656de91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I suspect it is the Blue 175A Anderson connector (same as on my PFC50). The color is important! The pins take 4 gauge wire on the 175A connector. This is plenty big for charging (and I have spools of it if you need some). Make sure that your charger is connected to the pack before the AC power is turned on. The charger is not isolated. I used to have two Kilovac contactors that engaged when AC power was connected to the charger. I would turn the charger off by the switch, so the pack was connected when power was available, and before I turned the switch. This would also isolate the pack from the charger when AC power was off. My car uses two contactors between the batteries and the motor controller, so the pack was isolated from the motor, DC-DC, etc when not driving. Gary ________________________________ From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of Micheal Drewry Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 2:16 PM To: OEVA Subject: [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation Hi all, I just heard from EV Parts my PFC-20 is shipping next week. This is the replacement for my failed Russco charger. Quick question for anyone who has installed one of these before. Does it come with the Anderson connectors I need? My current charger uses a very small connector on 14 gage wire and it looks like the ones coming out of the PFC are on very thick wires that look close to the size of wire I'm using between the batteries. Also, any other issues I need to be aware of? Any advice greatly appreciated. Thanks all! Mike Drewry http://www.evalbum.com/1371 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080814/f37115c3/attachment.html From rmerwin at aracnet.com Thu Aug 14 15:26:37 2008 From: rmerwin at aracnet.com (Ralph Merwin) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:26:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation In-Reply-To: <43e1e6a70808141415q6373f25ch2918f842a656de91@mail.gmail.com> from "Micheal Drewry" at Aug 14, 2008 02:15:59 PM Message-ID: <200808142226.m7EMQbw5017743@onyx.spiritone.com> Mike, The PFC-20 DC cable is terminated with an Anderson SB50 connector (50 Amp, Gray). EV Parts sells these, as does Northwest Battery on SE Belmont Street here in Portland. The cable is 10ga (if I remember correctly). The AC cable also 10ga. You may need to supply your own AC connector. The wiring instructions are in the installation manual that can be found online at http://www.manzanitamicro.com/download.htm Look for: PFC20 installation REV C As for other issues, note that the PFC chargers are not isolated. If you have the charger running while you're poking around in the pack you can get shocked. Make Real Darn Sure (tm) that you get the + and - connections to the pack correct! Also note that if you connect the green wire from the PFC to the car's chassis and your car happens to have a pack to frame short, the charger's control board may fail ungracefully. Rich Rudman (at Manzanita Micro) has an undocumented work-around for this potential problem. I'll let you get the details from Rich since the work-around is very, shall we say, nonstandard. Ralph Micheal Drewry writes: > > --===============1254192971== > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="----=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603" > > ------=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > > Hi all, > > I just heard from EV Parts my PFC-20 is shipping next week. This is the > replacement for my failed Russco charger. > > Quick question for anyone who has installed one of these before. Does it > come with the Anderson connectors I need? My current charger uses a very > small connector on 14 gage wire and it looks like the ones coming out of the > PFC are on very thick wires that look close to the size of wire I'm using > between the batteries. > > Also, any other issues I need to be aware of? > > Any advice greatly appreciated. Thanks all! > > Mike Drewry > http://www.evalbum.com/1371 > > ------=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603 > Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > >
Hi all,

I just heard from EV Parts my PFC-20 is shipping next week.   This is the replacement for my failed Russco charger.

Quick question for anyone who has installed one of these before.  Does it come with the Anderson connectors I need?   My current charger uses a very small connector on 14 gage wire and it looks like the ones coming out of the PFC are on very thick wires that look close to the size of wire I'm using between the batteries.
>
Also, any other issues I need to be aware of?

Any advice greatly appreciated.  Thanks all!

Mike Drewry
http://www.evalbum.com/1371
> > ------=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603-- > > --===============1254192971== > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > --===============1254192971==-- > From oeva_treas at verizon.net Thu Aug 14 16:54:35 2008 From: oeva_treas at verizon.net (OEVA Treasurer) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 16:54:35 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] FW: Converting car Message-ID: <002a01c8fe69$1b83e8f0$528bbad0$@net> OEVA: Does anyone have any advice for Diane? Thanks, Rick Barnes OEVA Treas From: D HUDDLESTON [mailto:DIHUDD1 at MSN.COM] Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 8:07 AM To: barnes.rick at verizon.net Subject: Converting car Hi: I'm Diane from Salem. I read an article on CNN.com about more and more people converting their regular gas engine cars and trucks to electric. I have a 1994 Toyota Tercel (4 cylinder, manual shift) which I am happy with. It runs fine now, but it has about 108,500 miles on it and I know it cannot run forever. I would like for my next car to be electric, but I really am not looking forward to five years of car payments, especially when I'll likely be starting to pay off my $$$$ student loans. I'm trying to look at options right now. Is a reliable conversion feasible with this kind of car? I only drive around town and at most go about 30 miles a couple of days a week. The car is still running fairly well so this is not an emergency. Perhaps it can wait until it starts acting up and I could convert it--by then maybe more people will be doing it and it won't be as expensive or take as long for parts. Of course I would still want my car to be a good-running, dependable car after a conversion. (I'd like to save a new car payment if I can). I am concerned about the environment and am absolutely incensed with the oil men in Washington and the big corporations and cannot stand putting money into their pockets. I am not mechanically inclined and would have to have a mechanic do this. Do you have any suggestions? What would you guestimate the cost of conversion to be? Diane Huddleston Salem, Oregon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080814/10a9ae9e/attachment-0001.html From barnes.rick at verizon.net Thu Aug 14 17:15:29 2008 From: barnes.rick at verizon.net (Rick Barnes) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:15:29 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation In-Reply-To: <200808142226.m7EMQbw5017743@onyx.spiritone.com> References: <43e1e6a70808141415q6373f25ch2918f842a656de91@mail.gmail.com> from "Micheal Drewry" at Aug 14, 2008 02:15:59 PM <200808142226.m7EMQbw5017743@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <004101c8fe6c$06e47e20$14ad7a60$@rick@verizon.net> Also never touch Rich Rudman's car Goldie while it is charging...... I brushed up against it at PIR a few years ago and yippee never do that again..... Rick -----Original Message----- From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of Ralph Merwin Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 3:27 PM To: Micheal Drewry Cc: OEVA Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation Mike, The PFC-20 DC cable is terminated with an Anderson SB50 connector (50 Amp, Gray). EV Parts sells these, as does Northwest Battery on SE Belmont Street here in Portland. The cable is 10ga (if I remember correctly). The AC cable also 10ga. You may need to supply your own AC connector. The wiring instructions are in the installation manual that can be found online at http://www.manzanitamicro.com/download.htm Look for: PFC20 installation REV C As for other issues, note that the PFC chargers are not isolated. If you have the charger running while you're poking around in the pack you can get shocked. Make Real Darn Sure (tm) that you get the + and - connections to the pack correct! Also note that if you connect the green wire from the PFC to the car's chassis and your car happens to have a pack to frame short, the charger's control board may fail ungracefully. Rich Rudman (at Manzanita Micro) has an undocumented work-around for this potential problem. I'll let you get the details from Rich since the work-around is very, shall we say, nonstandard. Ralph Micheal Drewry writes: > > --===============1254192971== > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="----=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603" > > ------=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > > Hi all, > > I just heard from EV Parts my PFC-20 is shipping next week. This is the > replacement for my failed Russco charger. > > Quick question for anyone who has installed one of these before. Does it > come with the Anderson connectors I need? My current charger uses a very > small connector on 14 gage wire and it looks like the ones coming out of the > PFC are on very thick wires that look close to the size of wire I'm using > between the batteries. > > Also, any other issues I need to be aware of? > > Any advice greatly appreciated. Thanks all! > > Mike Drewry > http://www.evalbum.com/1371 > > ------=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603 > Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > >
Hi all,

I just heard from EV Parts my PFC-20 is shipping next week.   This is the replacement for my failed Russco charger.

Quick question for anyone who has installed one of these before.  Does it come with the Anderson connectors I need?   My current charger uses a very small connector on 14 gage wire and it looks like the ones coming out of the PFC are on very thick wires that look close to the size of wire I'm using between the batteries.
>
Also, any other issues I need to be aware of?

Any advice greatly appreciated.  Thanks all!

Mike Drewry
http://www.evalbum.com/1371
> > ------=_Part_140335_25067545.1218748559603-- > > --===============1254192971== > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > --===============1254192971==-- > _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list From stevel at fern.com Thu Aug 14 20:50:28 2008 From: stevel at fern.com (Steve's Account) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 20:50:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Circuit celler article about EV induction motor controller.. Message-ID: I've just subscribed to the list.. and it's entirely possible that this has already been mentioned on the list.. but I thought I'd post it while the issue was still available on the newstand. Camosun University has producted an open source EV induction motor controler.. Here's the details: Steve From gpzmotoman at comcast.net Fri Aug 15 03:24:36 2008 From: gpzmotoman at comcast.net (Frederick Trient) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 03:24:36 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] OMG Message-ID: Hi all: Oh my God. What have I gotten myself into? I'm totally new to the scene. As I promised to Tim at this night's meeting at the W.T.C. I'm proclaiming myself (or feebly waving a hesitant hand) as point man for a club car project. (quiver, blanch) It occurred to me that we could talk and talk and talk about conversion projects but what would it come down to if face to face with the actual mechanical realities of a project car? Panic? Maybe, but what better way to get through the fright and frustrations of a conversion than to get down and dirty actually doing it? Well being a hard core, if naive, D.I.Y. sort of guy I thought "how about we do a car as a club"? Simple, verdad? Nyet! Well dear friends I have no expertise in electrics, fabrications and am an owner of a petro monster anti-Christ - a '65 El Camino. Well there are the job description disclaimers. Oops, add also I'm a swing shift worker and have to beg time off just to attend meetings. All I gots is a belief that we need to do something NOW! Sooooo . . . (swinging at the pitch no matter if it's high, low, wide or tight) who wants to get dirty? As depressingly pointed out to me we have many hurdles to jump and mountains to climb. Just to highlight a few: 1) where would one get the funding, 2) how do we protect the club from liability, 3) who owns the physical property, 4) where would it be located, 5) who would do the work, 6) how would it be insured, 7) what of DMV, 8) what of donations, 9) AC or DC, 10) who would provide expert advice, 11) etc. etc.? I'm inviting all those with or without expertise to get together and tease out this puzzle. Beat it into submission. Accost those not on the list. Browbeat, wheedle and threaten those who might be of value if you have no enthusiasm for the project yourself. Even if you don't want to put hands on, your experience with how club projects function or self destruct could be invaluable. Truly. Regards, Fred Trient From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Fri Aug 15 07:59:07 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 07:59:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] OMG Message-ID: <664848.47411.qm@web36907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi Fred, Thanks for the eloquent message and the willingness to jump right in. If you get a good response from people, I might suggest starting your own GoogleGroup e-email list so you can have a lively discussion without overwhelming the main OEVA list. I'd also be happy to set aside a chunk of time (half hour to an hour) at a future meeting to get input from the larger group. Best wishes on your path to EVdom. Cheers, Tim Kutscha, OEVA Chair http://civic-ev.blogspot.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Frederick Trient To: OEVA Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 3:24:36 AM Subject: [Oeva-list] OMG Hi all: Oh my God. What have I gotten myself into? I'm totally new to the scene. As I promised to Tim at this night's meeting at the W.T.C. I'm proclaiming myself (or feebly waving a hesitant hand) as point man for a club car project. (quiver, blanch) It occurred to me that we could talk and talk and talk about conversion projects but what would it come down to if face to face with the actual mechanical realities of a project car? Panic? Maybe, but what better way to get through the fright and frustrations of a conversion than to get down and dirty actually doing it? Well being a hard core, if naive, D.I.Y. sort of guy I thought "how about we do a car as a club"? Simple, verdad? Nyet! Well dear friends I have no expertise in electrics, fabrications and am an owner of a petro monster anti-Christ - a '65 El Camino. Well there are the job description disclaimers. Oops, add also I'm a swing shift worker and have to beg time off just to attend meetings. All I gots is a belief that we need to do something NOW! Sooooo . . . (swinging at the pitch no matter if it's high, low, wide or tight) who wants to get dirty? As depressingly pointed out to me we have many hurdles to jump and mountains to climb. Just to highlight a few: 1) where would one get the funding, 2) how do we protect the club from liability, 3) who owns the physical property, 4) where would it be located, 5) who would do the work, 6) how would it be insured, 7) what of DMV, 8) what of donations, 9) AC or DC, 10) who would provide expert advice, 11) etc. etc.? I'm inviting all those with or without expertise to get together and tease out this puzzle. Beat it into submission. Accost those not on the list. Browbeat, wheedle and threaten those who might be of value if you have no enthusiasm for the project yourself. Even if you don't want to put hands on, your experience with how club projects function or self destruct could be invaluable. Truly. Regards, Fred Trient _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080815/76153578/attachment.html From chris at darkstarpro.com Fri Aug 15 17:31:45 2008 From: chris at darkstarpro.com (chris at darkstarpro.com) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 20:31:45 -0400 Subject: [Oeva-list] Looking to Help on Westside Message-ID: <380-22008861603145545@M2W017.mail2web.com> Hi, I had the opportunity to attend the OEVA meeting for the first time last night and enjoyed being able to meet a lot of you that already have dived into EV or those that are excited about going EV. I wanted to throw out my information as I'm looking to be able to assist in helping with a car conversion. I'm fairly mechanically inclined and have solid basic electrical skills, however I have no real fabrication skills (other than some stick welding I did in high school 12 years ago). I'm generally available evenings and weekends, however I would like to stay on the Westside as I live near Baseline & Brookwood in Hillsboro (Hillsboro and Beaverton areas). Please feel free to shoot me an email off of the OEVA list with your current project and we can exchange phone numbers. My email address is chris [at] darkstarpro.com. Thanks! Sincerely, Chris Arnesen -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://link.mail2web.com/mail2web From oeva_treas at verizon.net Sat Aug 16 17:07:58 2008 From: oeva_treas at verizon.net (OEVA Treasurer) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:07:58 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] FW: Recharge Stations Message-ID: <001801c8fffd$4ed882c0$ec898840$@net> OEVA: Charging subgroup, can you assist Scott? Rick Barnes OEVS Treas From: Scott Ponder [mailto:scott at devcoengineering.com] Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 8:08 AM To: barnes.rick at verizon.net Subject: Recharge Stations Mr. Barnes, Good Morning, I am working on getting a HEV recharge station in our area and I am having a hard time finding manufacturers of these stations. Can you direct me to a place I can find them? I would like to know what options are available. Thanks, Scott A. Ponder, EIT, LSIT Devco Engineering, Inc. 541.757.8991 (phone) 541.757.9885 (fax) mail: POB 1211, Corvallis, OR 97339 office: 245 NE Conifer Blvd., Corvallis, OR 97330 email: scott at devcoengineering.com cid:011132022 at 07072008-29A0 Privacy Notice: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact me by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080816/bd250eb4/attachment.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/jpeg Size: 1366 bytes Desc: not available Url : /pipermail/attachments/20080816/bd250eb4/attachment.jpe From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Sat Aug 16 19:38:04 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 19:38:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Corvette GTP to go solar electric Message-ID: <561876.39706.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi All, I received this message and wanted to forward on the youTube link... Cheers, Tim ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Karl Thomson To: oeva- at bad-seed.org Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2008 9:53:12 AM Subject: OEVA.org: tim_kutscha_yahoo.com feedback: We have plans to make our supercar solar electric This is a the only street legal Corvette GTP in the world we build and sell these in Toledo Ohio. http://www.youtube.com/v/R7_J_Jm6iFk&hl -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080816/42ddeca7/attachment.html From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Sat Aug 16 19:42:01 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 19:42:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Help for conversion in Southern Oregon? Message-ID: <307247.62041.qm@web36904.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Does anyone know of a good EV mechanic in southern Oregon or EV contacts down there? Cheers, Tim Kutscha OEVA Chair ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Linda Bellingham To: oeva- at bad-seed.org Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 12:37:39 PM Subject: OEVA.org: tim_kutscha_yahoo.com feedback: I'm very interested/excited about converting a car to all electric. Can you direct me to resources in southern Oregon? I live in Jacksonville. I'll need advice about a conversion kit, a good mechanic, and all the support available! Thanks for your help! Linda -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080816/fed31f5f/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 01:03:59 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 01:03:59 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] OT: Washington Post: Oil Shock Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808170103o20ccae91tff602b911fdb8b12@mail.gmail.com> http://tinyurl.com/6mgqrl Global Pressures Have Converged to Forge a New Oil Reality "The Washington Post examines the economic forces that have unhinged oil prices from their longtime cyclical patterns, propelling fuel costs to once unimaginable levels that are now both fraying the lifestyles of our recent past and speeding the search for an energy source of the future." - Why Does Gas Cost $4 a Gallon? - Major Global Trade Impacts - U.S. Oil Production vs. Consumption - Global Summit on Oil Merely an Act of Diplomacy - Rising Oil and Gas Prices, Predictions - Record Breaking Profits for Big Oil Peak Oil is less about running out of oil, as it is about running out of easy to access oil. Well-to-pump pollution will continue to increase; all while demand grows uninhibited. The only thing sustainable about gasoline is the increasing cost. Oil-producing countries are benefiting from the most massive transfers of wealth in history. Cheap oil has been a building block of the American economy and society. Any shift away from gasoline will also need a new way to fund highways. Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080817/c36555e0/attachment.html From richardturnock at comcast.net Sun Aug 17 13:58:54 2008 From: richardturnock at comcast.net (Richard Turnock) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 13:58:54 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Gas Prices Message-ID: <4A3E337119EA4EB092CEB28A52A50B27@RichardPC> Everyday in newspapers, on the internet, on the radio and TV, we are asked to believe what someone says about global climate change or the price of gasoline. Also, we are asked to believe that the two presidential candidates each know how to govern. My brother had a trout farm with above-ground tanks using constantly running well-water. Predators, primarily birds, threatened to eat the smaller fish so he used nets over the top. One of his employees said he saw a beaver near one of the tanks and the beaver was probably eating fish. My brother paused, looked at him and asked him what the animal looked like. He answered angrily, "I know what a beaver looks like." >From the LA Times: "You may not believe it, but fuel is more affordable than it was during the early '60s." http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-goklany11-2008aug11,0,1107249.stor y Richard -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080817/560ccc71/attachment.html From copperlion at copperlionslair.com Sun Aug 17 19:13:34 2008 From: copperlion at copperlionslair.com (Kevin Seeber) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:13:34 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Gas Prices In-Reply-To: <4A3E337119EA4EB092CEB28A52A50B27@RichardPC> References: <4A3E337119EA4EB092CEB28A52A50B27@RichardPC> Message-ID: <48A8DACE.2080809@copperlionslair.com> Not to be attacking anyone, but I didn't find that article very helpful or clear. I hope that the article, and possibly my take on it, sparks some civil debate and possibly some other articles to reference and make this clear. I also hope that it doesn't induce apathy or anger. The biggest issue I see with the article is that it doesn't explain how the author(s) come up with the figures. I have a couple other issues with the article, regarding the assumptions and how average disposable income was determined, as well. I heard recently about how the average income figures are going up primarily due to the top 5% of the wealthiest of people increasing their incomes at an alarming rate, more than balancing out the average decline of the bottom third of the population. I am not claiming this as fact, though it wouldn't surprise me if it was. I have no references to back up my figures. My point in bringing this up, is that the figures the article uses have very little reference, and can not give you the entire picture. If the average personal income includes the wealthiest people in the U.S., who have profited greatly under the current administration, then the numbers are skewed. If the author(s) were talking about the median income- where 50% of working people make more money, and 50% make less- I would find this to be a more useful comparison. It would be closer to what real people have to deal with. Comparing the median to the mean average would also paint a clearer picture of the state we are in. Another comparison that would make more sense to me would be the median or mean average percentage of a person's actual income that is spent on gasoline, general transportation costs, and/or energy costs in general. Any other suggestions? -Kevin Richard Turnock wrote: > > > > Everyday in newspapers, on the internet, on the radio and TV, we are > asked to believe what someone says about global climate change or the > price of gasoline. Also, we are asked to believe that the two > presidential candidates each know how to govern. > > > > My brother had a trout farm with above-ground tanks using constantly > running well-water. Predators, primarily birds, threatened to eat the > smaller fish so he used nets over the top. One of his employees said > he saw a beaver near one of the tanks and the beaver was probably > eating fish. My brother paused, looked at him and asked him what the > animal looked like. He answered angrily, ?I know what a beaver looks > like.? > > > > From the LA Times: > > ?You may not believe it, but fuel is more affordable than it was > during the early '60s.? > > http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-goklany11-2008aug11,0,1107249.story > > > > Richard > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080817/aca8fc9a/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 23:24:21 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 23:24:21 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] KillaCycle Coming to Oregon Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808172324t5c9fec5brd0fe578a990304b6@mail.gmail.com> >From the EVDL: ------------------------------------------------------------- From: Bill Dube Subject: [EVDL] KillaCycle at Woodburn, Oregon, Aug 22-24th To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Message-ID: <20080815173025.3B26E87093 at spaceymail-a5.g.dreamhost.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed KillaCycle and EV drag racing fans, We will be running the KillaCycle at Woodburn Oregon at the All Harley Drag Racing Association "Northwest Nationals" event on August 22, 23, and 24th. (We will probably arrive sometime on Friday afternoon and will likely make a test pass sometime after 3 PM. It isn't certain we will do this, however.) They typically put us in the sequence just before Top Fuel (TF). Here is a link to the run schedule: http://www.ahdra.com/2008pdf/ORSchedule08.pdf Event info: http://www.ahdra.com/schedor2008.html Drop by and see us run. Come by the pits and visit. We are always happy to chat with EVers and drag racing fans. Bill Dube' -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080817/6b7b275f/attachment.html From jeff.shorepower at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 01:16:27 2008 From: jeff.shorepower at gmail.com (Jeff Kim) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 01:16:27 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Recharge Stations Message-ID: <83b7b17c0808180116p245cf5e4l4c982ae4f9dec5c8@mail.gmail.com> Hi Scott, We offer several different charging stations. You are welcome to email me directly or give me a call. -- Jeff Kim Chief Operating Officer Shorepower Technologies (503) 686-8844 jkim at shorepower.com www.shorepower.com ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "OEVA Treasurer" To: "'OEVA'" Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:07:58 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] FW: Recharge Stations OEVA: Charging subgroup, can you assist Scott? Rick Barnes OEVS Treas scott at devcoengineering.com *From:* Scott Ponder [mailto:scott at devcoengineering.com] *Sent:* Friday, August 15, 2008 8:08 AM *To:* barnes.rick at verizon.net *Subject:* Recharge Stations Mr. Barnes, Good Morning, I am working on getting a HEV recharge station in our area and I am having a hard time finding manufacturers of these stations. Can you direct me to a place I can find them? I would like to know what options are available. Thanks, *Scott A. Ponder, EIT, LSIT * Devco Engineering, Inc. 541.757.8991 (phone) 541.757.9885 (fax) mail: POB 1211, Corvallis, OR 97339 office: 245 NE Conifer Blvd., Corvallis, OR 97330 email: scott at devcoengineering.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080818/df7c789c/attachment-0001.html From nevokyay at yahoo.com Mon Aug 18 09:30:40 2008 From: nevokyay at yahoo.com (Nev Okyay) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 09:30:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Gas Prices In-Reply-To: <48A8DACE.2080809@copperlionslair.com> Message-ID: <28106.76128.qm@web55105.mail.re4.yahoo.com> This forum probably is not the place to discuss a topic like this, but I agree with the previous poster. The authors' numbers don't add up. Go to the Department of Commerce website cited in the article. Line 25 shows the disposable income for 2007 Q1, 2007 Q2 as $10,013.50 and $10,088.00. For 2008 Q1 and 2008 Q2 as $10440.0 and $10,833.40. Then the average disposable income increased over 2007 by $10,050.75 - $10,636.70= which is $585.95. The article is claiming that it increased by $1627. http://www.bea.gov/national/nipaweb/TableView.asp?SelectedTable=58&FirstYear=2006&LastYear=2008&Freq=Qtr (or search in google, 'department of commerce disposable income). --- Kevin Seeber wrote: > Not to be attacking anyone, but I didn't find that > article very helpful > or clear. I hope that the article, and possibly my > take on it, sparks > some civil debate and possibly some other articles > to reference and make > this clear. I also hope that it doesn't induce > apathy or anger. > > The biggest issue I see with the article is that it > doesn't explain how > the author(s) come up with the figures. I have a > couple other issues > with the article, regarding the assumptions and how > average disposable > income was determined, as well. > > I heard recently about how the average income > figures are going up > primarily due to the top 5% of the wealthiest of > people increasing their > incomes at an alarming rate, more than balancing out > the average decline > of the bottom third of the population. I am not > claiming this as fact, > though it wouldn't surprise me if it was. I have no > references to back > up my figures. My point in bringing this up, is that > the figures the > article uses have very little reference, and can not > give you the entire > picture. If the average personal income includes the > wealthiest people > in the U.S., who have profited greatly under the > current administration, > then the numbers are skewed. > > If the author(s) were talking about the median > income- where 50% of > working people make more money, and 50% make less- I > would find this to > be a more useful comparison. It would be closer to > what real people have > to deal with. Comparing the median to the mean > average would also paint > a clearer picture of the state we are in. Another > comparison that would > make more sense to me would be the median or mean > average percentage of > a person's actual income that is spent on gasoline, > general > transportation costs, and/or energy costs in > general. > > Any other suggestions? > > -Kevin > > Richard Turnock wrote: > > > > > > > > Everyday in newspapers, on the internet, on the > radio and TV, we are > > asked to believe what someone says about global > climate change or the > > price of gasoline. Also, we are asked to believe > that the two > > presidential candidates each know how to govern. > > > > > > > > My brother had a trout farm with above-ground > tanks using constantly > > running well-water. Predators, primarily birds, > threatened to eat the > > smaller fish so he used nets over the top. One of > his employees said > > he saw a beaver near one of the tanks and the > beaver was probably > > eating fish. My brother paused, looked at him and > asked him what the > > animal looked like. He answered angrily, ???I > know what a beaver looks > > like.??? > > > > > > > > From the LA Times: > > > > ???You may not believe it, but fuel is more > affordable than it was > > during the early '60s.??? > > > > > http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-goklany11-2008aug11,0,1107249.story > > > > > > > > Richard > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oeva-list mailing list > > Oeva-list at oeva.org > > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > From bob at research13.com Mon Aug 18 15:17:45 2008 From: bob at research13.com (bob at research13.com) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:17:45 +0000 Subject: [Oeva-list] Gas Prices Message-ID: I think most would agree with me that the author's perception of a basket of goods and gas inflation are a bit off. Along with his inflation, I also think that unemployment is factored out (significantly with figures from Reagan on). I have a similar feeling when I see articles that suggest food prices will increase with bio fuels. It's suggested to be causal that biofuels will cause food prices to rise. Does this mean that we won't mostly buy our produce from other nations anymore and it might improve our capital accounts and reduce our need to subsidize farmers too? I'll no longer have Brazillian Tomatos. That'd be weird. I put my Economics degree to work on the Beavers problem and they are Herbivores, so one likely did not eat your brother's fish, unless it was a Frat Boy from OSU after a bad Civil War game. Or an MIT Beaver with no Oliver Smoot to roll. I think that gas prices are an issue with most americans right now regardless what the author says. And I also believe that the 13% increase in Tri-Met Bus and Streetcar ridership may have something to do with the cost of driving a car and the record profits of oil companies. I also feel that we are financing our debt to foreigners, to buy oil and polluting the planet, even without the grandfathering in of PGE's Boardman coal plant. I also note that voting for Perot or Nader can impact elections. If a population, say California, votes a protest vote, they could even get a Hummer Driving Terminator elected. And did. Hasta la vista baby. P.S. Please sign me up to help with a club e-car - has that conversation moved elsewhere? -----Original Message----- From: Kevin Seeber [mailto:copperlion at copperlionslair.com] Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 07:13 PM Cc: oeva-list at oeva.org Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] Gas Prices Not to be attacking anyone, but I didn't find that article very helpful or clear. I hope that the article, and possibly my take on it, sparks some civil debate and possibly some other articles to reference and make this clear. I also hope that it doesn't induce apathy or anger. The biggest issue I see with the article is that it doesn't explain how the author(s) come up with the figures. I have a couple other issues with the article, regarding the assumptions and how average disposable income was determined, as well. I heard recently about how the average income figures are going up primarily due to the top 5% of the wealthiest of people increasing their incomes at an alarming rate, more than balancing out the average decline of the bottom third of the population. I am not claiming this as fact, though it wouldn't surprise me if it was. I have no references to back up my figures. My point in bringing this up, is that the figures the article uses have very little reference, and can not give you the entire picture. If the average personal income includes the wealthiest people in the U.S., who have profited greatly under the current administration, then the numbers are skewed. If the author(s) were talking about the median income- where 50% of working people make more money, and 50% make less- I would find this to be a more useful comparison. It would be closer to what real people have to deal with. Comparing the median to the mean average would also paint a clearer picture of the state we are in. Another comparison that would make more sense to me would be the median or mean average percentage of a person's actual income that is spent on gasoline, general transportation costs, and/or energy costs in general. Any other suggestions? -Kevin Richard Turnock wrote: Everyday in newspapers, on the internet, on the radio and TV, we are asked to believe what someone says about global climate change or the price of gasoline. Also, we are asked to believe that the two presidential candidates each know how to govern. My brother had a trout farm with above-ground tanks using constantly running well-water. Predators, primarily birds, threatened to eat the smaller fish so he used nets over the top. One of his employees said he saw a beaver near one of the tanks and the beaver was probably eating fish. My brother paused, looked at him and asked him what the animal looked like. He answered angrily, ?I know what a beaver looks like.? >From the LA Times: ?You may not believe it, but fuel is more affordable than it was during the early '60s.? http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-goklany11-2008aug11,0,1107249.story Richard ------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________Oeva-list mailing listOeva-list at oeva.orghttp://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080818/a80639c6/attachment.html From william.norris-york at intel.com Tue Aug 19 11:25:58 2008 From: william.norris-york at intel.com (Norris-York, William) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 11:25:58 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Charger question Message-ID: <9D39833986E69849A2A8E74C1078B6B3E0C7F2@orsmsx415.amr.corp.intel.com> I have a 120 volt battery pack (20 6 volt Trojan 145s, flooded batteries) and I am trying to decide what charger to get. What would you suggest? I can't afford the $3,600 charger from Manzanita, but something sub $1,000 would be great. Thanks, Bill -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080819/341c4ed1/attachment.html From rmerwin at aracnet.com Tue Aug 19 13:16:57 2008 From: rmerwin at aracnet.com (Ralph Merwin) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 13:16:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Charger question In-Reply-To: <9D39833986E69849A2A8E74C1078B6B3E0C7F2@orsmsx415.amr.corp.intel.com> from "Norris-York, William" at Aug 19, 2008 11:25:58 AM Message-ID: <200808192016.m7JKGvcG009897@onyx.spiritone.com> Bill, I just checked on the Manzanita Micro web page - you seem to be looking at the top-of-the-line PFC-50. A simple PFC-20 would probably work just fine for your batteries, and it lists for $1860. It's pretty hard to get a more capable charger for less than this. Ralph Norris-York, William writes: > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > --===============1265551302== > Content-class: urn:content-classes:message > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48" > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > I have a 120 volt battery pack (20 6 volt Trojan 145s, flooded > batteries) and I am trying to decide what charger to get. What would > you suggest? I can't afford the $3,600 charger from Manzanita, but > something sub $1,000 would be great. > > =20 > > Thanks, > > Bill > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48 > Content-Type: text/html; > charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" = > xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> > > > charset=3Dus-ascii"> > > > > > > > >
> >

style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > font-family:Arial'>I have a 120 volt battery pack (20 6 volt Trojan = > 145s, > flooded batteries) and I am trying to decide what charger to get.  = > What would > you suggest?  I can’t afford the $3,600 charger from = > Manzanita, but > something sub $1,000 would be great.

> >

style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > font-family:Arial'> 

> >

style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > font-family:Arial'>Thanks,

> >

style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > font-family:Arial'>Bill

> >
> > > > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48-- > > --===============1265551302== > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > --===============1265551302==-- > From glassphoto at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 14:32:14 2008 From: glassphoto at gmail.com (Micheal Drewry) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 14:32:14 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Charger question In-Reply-To: <200808192016.m7JKGvcG009897@onyx.spiritone.com> References: <9D39833986E69849A2A8E74C1078B6B3E0C7F2@orsmsx415.amr.corp.intel.com> <200808192016.m7JKGvcG009897@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <43e1e6a70808191432y1bcb21b9g4020de99dcd554e7@mail.gmail.com> I agree with Ralph. My PFC-20 will be here sometime this week. Lead time is a bit long (several months). I had been using a Russco charger (about $800) but after 2 trips to the factory (house in Grants Pass, OR) Russ could not get it to work and I gave up. There is the Zivan (about $900) Electro Auto carries both the Russco and Zivan chargers. I have not heard anything about their quality though. The PFCs have an excellent reputation. Mike On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 1:16 PM, Ralph Merwin wrote: > > Bill, > > I just checked on the Manzanita Micro web page - you seem to be looking > at the top-of-the-line PFC-50. A simple PFC-20 would probably work just > fine for your batteries, and it lists for $1860. It's pretty hard to get > a more capable charger for less than this. > > Ralph > > > Norris-York, William writes: > > > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > > > --===============1265551302== > > Content-class: urn:content-classes:message > > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > > boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48" > > > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48 > > Content-Type: text/plain; > > charset="us-ascii" > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > I have a 120 volt battery pack (20 6 volt Trojan 145s, flooded > > batteries) and I am trying to decide what charger to get. What would > > you suggest? I can't afford the $3,600 charger from Manzanita, but > > something sub $1,000 would be great. > > > > =20 > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bill > > > > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48 > > Content-Type: text/html; > > charset="us-ascii" > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" = > > xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> > > > > > > > charset=3Dus-ascii"> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > >

> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > > font-family:Arial'>I have a 120 volt battery pack (20 6 volt Trojan = > > 145s, > > flooded batteries) and I am trying to decide what charger to get.  = > > What would > > you suggest?  I can’t afford the $3,600 charger from = > > Manzanita, but > > something sub $1,000 would be great.

> > > >

> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > > font-family:Arial'> 

> > > >

> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > > font-family:Arial'>Thanks,

> > > >

> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt; > > font-family:Arial'>Bill

> > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48-- > > > > --===============1265551302== > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Content-Disposition: inline > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oeva-list mailing list > > Oeva-list at oeva.org > > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > > > > --===============1265551302==-- > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080819/ac859285/attachment.html From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Tue Aug 19 15:50:21 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:50:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Charger question Message-ID: <526932.84627.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi Bill, (and Mike and Ralph), I have a Zivan NG3 charger in my electric 914 and have not had any issues. I use 8V flooded batteries. The Zivan does overcharge them a bit to balance the pack, so I think it would be a good charger for floodeds. I've heard that Zivans tend to be a bit too aggressive for AGM batteries like the Optima YTs. In short, I think the Zivan is great for flooded batteries. Cheers, Tim OEVA Chair http://914ev.blogspot.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Micheal Drewry To: Ralph Merwin Cc: oeva Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 2:32:14 PM Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] Charger question I agree with Ralph. My PFC-20 will be here sometime this week. Lead time is a bit long (several months). I had been using a Russco charger (about $800) but after 2 trips to the factory (house in Grants Pass, OR) Russ could not get it to work and I gave up. There is the Zivan (about $900) Electro Auto carries both the Russco and Zivan chargers. I have not heard anything about their quality though. The PFCs have an excellent reputation. Mike On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 1:16 PM, Ralph Merwin wrote: Bill, I just checked on the Manzanita Micro web page - you seem to be looking at the top-of-the-line PFC-50. A simple PFC-20 would probably work just fine for your batteries, and it lists for $1860. It's pretty hard to get a more capable charger for less than this. Ralph Norris-York, William writes: > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > --===============1265551302== > Content-class: urn:content-classes:message > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48" > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------_=_NextPart_001_01C90229.0656DD48 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > I have a 120 volt battery pack (20 6 volt Trojan 145s, flooded > batteries) and I am trying to decide what charger to get. What would > you suggest? I can't afford the $3,600 charger from Manzanita, but > something sub $1,000 would be great. > > =20 > > Thanks, > > Bill -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080819/5e6b0dc9/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 17:14:00 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 17:14:00 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Diane Rehm's show interviews EV folks Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808191714s73638d46l939e234fa8989006@mail.gmail.com> If you can tolerate Diane's "relaxed pace" and lack of EV knowledge, the guests give some good info. http://tinyurl.com/5al927 *Electric Cars* > High gas prices and concerns about emissions have many drivers searching > for alternatives ? including vehicles powered by electricity. A look at new > developments in the effort to mass produce affordable, safe, and easy to > charge electric cars > > *Guests*: > *Chelsea Sexton*, co-founder, Plug In America > *Les Goldman*, attorney in private practice representing A123 > *John O'Dell*, senior editor, Edmunds.com Green Car Adviser > *Elon Musk*, founder and chair, Tesla Motors > Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080819/ae21190d/attachment-0001.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 12:58:35 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 12:58:35 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] The Future of the Electric Car - Wired mag cover story Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808201258o112ab309i64769bc94b068765@mail.gmail.com> Short story: *Charge!* Electric-car visionary would overhaul the way we get around http://www.grist.org/news/2008/08/19/better_place/ Full Story: *Driven*: Shai Agassi's Audacious Plan to Put Electric Cars on the Road http://www.wired.com/cars/futuretransport/magazine/16-09/ff_agassi?currentPage=all -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080820/09e32373/attachment.html From timj.pdx at verizon.net Wed Aug 20 13:54:17 2008 From: timj.pdx at verizon.net (Tim Johnson) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:54:17 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Charger question In-Reply-To: <526932.84627.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <526932.84627.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48AC8479.2020108@verizon.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080820/464867ce/attachment.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: scubalogo.gif Type: image/gif Size: 1351 bytes Desc: not available Url : /pipermail/attachments/20080820/464867ce/attachment.gif From AlphaWaveE at aol.com Wed Aug 20 22:22:50 2008 From: AlphaWaveE at aol.com (AlphaWaveE at aol.com) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 01:22:50 EDT Subject: [Oeva-list] Warp motors anyone? Message-ID: I am planning on sending in an order for a few warp motors next week, but only two are spoken for at this time. I am not trying to cut in on the dealership that is down there, but if someone in my general area of Cowlitz County wants to order one, or for some other reason wants to contact me, please give me a call. Wade Patterson dba Alpha Wave Electric (360) 425-6252 **************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080821/028d0502/attachment.html From paburkey at juno.com Thu Aug 21 08:36:06 2008 From: paburkey at juno.com (Paul A Burkey) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 08:36:06 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] August and early September Events Message-ID: <20080821.083607.524.5.paburkey@juno.com> Hi, August 24th Oregon State Fair, OSU Solar Car will be on display. September 6th Our street fair will be Sept. 6 (Saturday) and we?ll do the alternative vehicle expo near the 34th and Belmont intersection again. Muddy Boot Organic Festival The OEVA just got invited to show some EVs at the Alternative Energy & Sustainable Living Show out at the Washington County Fairgrounds September 5-7. They were psyched to have electric vehicles there, so they even waived the fee for us. Since several of you are out in Hillsboro/Beaverton, I thought this would be right up your alley. This will be outdoors, so we'll probably have to set up a canopy (for shade in the sun or for dryness in the rain). Admission is free and this is right on the MAX line. Paul B., please add this to the EVents list. Ross O., would you please add this to the EVents calendar?The website is: http://www.wampromotions.com/Events.htmlSince this is a 3-day event, I hope we can have several folks sign up to attend the information table. We get a 10x10 spot and a place out in the field to show vehicles.Please let me know if you can show your vehicle or can attend the table at this EVent. Paul BurkeyOngoing Events Chair ____________________________________________________________ Click for free home mortgage rates from top companies. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m36jTOT1LzyPJFcOkDyyWnrswpuFOGlwfOaL74sxvXVtjSZ/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080821/1aeeb34a/attachment.html From chuff at deathmint.com Sat Aug 23 22:31:08 2008 From: chuff at deathmint.com (Chris Hufnagel) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 22:31:08 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] NYTimes report on EV racing at PIR Message-ID: <48B0F21C.3010403@deathmint.com> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/24/automobiles/24ELECTRA.html?ex=1377144000&en=609ae341a691c2d0&ei=5124&partner=permalink&exprod=permalink From nevokyay at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 12:33:23 2008 From: nevokyay at yahoo.com (Nev Okyay) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:33:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] manual or automatic transmission.. Message-ID: <99767.89313.qm@web55103.mail.re4.yahoo.com> which would be easier to convert? is it easier to build/find an adaptor plate for the motor for manual transmission? or is this just a driving preference? any thoughts on this? thanks - nev From william.norris-york at intel.com Tue Aug 26 12:42:03 2008 From: william.norris-york at intel.com (Norris-York, William) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:42:03 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] manual or automatic transmission.. In-Reply-To: <99767.89313.qm@web55103.mail.re4.yahoo.com> References: <99767.89313.qm@web55103.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4911F71203A09E4D9981D27F9D8308581B6B7A@orsmsx503.amr.corp.intel.com> Here are my thoughts . . . I believe that you have to use a manual transmission when doing an electric conversion because the automatic transmissions need to have pressure in the system in order to do the shifting/. Since the electric motor is at 0 RPMs at a stop, there wouldn't by anything to keep the pressure up in the transmission to allow you to shift to reverse for example. However, I thought I saw a gizmo online that you could use to allow you to use an automatic transmission. Also, automatic transmissions are geared to allow for an engine's usable torch range, which is usually pretty high (2,000 RPMs and higher), but the electric motor has all of its torch at 0 RPMs, so it is common to have your car in 2nd gear when going from 0 MPH to 45 MPH, then shift into a lower gear, 1st gear becomes obsolete in an electric car. Bill -----Original Message----- From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of Nev Okyay Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 12:33 PM To: oeva-list at oeva.org Subject: [Oeva-list] manual or automatic transmission.. which would be easier to convert? is it easier to build/find an adaptor plate for the motor for manual transmission? or is this just a driving preference? any thoughts on this? thanks - nev _______________________________________________ Oeva-list mailing list Oeva-list at oeva.org http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list From tony at notebene.net Wed Aug 27 11:40:52 2008 From: tony at notebene.net (Tony McCormick) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 11:40:52 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Performance AEV Message-ID: <48B59FB4.9070706@notebene.net> Who is: http://www.performanceaev.com/ The website does not list any personal information, like the owners name. I t would be good to be able to refer potential customers to a local conversion company, but I'm out of the loop regarding who is running this business, etc ... The concept of a 2 year warranty is appealing to many new EVers, but it's only as good as the people behind it. Some 'bio' info on the website would be useful... I think. -- Tony McCormick -------------------------------- http://www.notebene.net & http://www.backporchrevival.com From nevokyay at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 11:42:13 2008 From: nevokyay at yahoo.com (Nev Okyay) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 11:42:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] manual or automatic transmission.. In-Reply-To: <4911F71203A09E4D9981D27F9D8308581B6B7A@orsmsx503.amr.corp.intel.com> Message-ID: <373879.17601.qm@web55105.mail.re4.yahoo.com> In addition to the problems you mentioned below, there may also be problems with cooling the transmission oil. It seems like although it is not impossible to convert an automatic transmission, it would be a lot harder to do it.. thanks Bill - nev --- "Norris-York, William" wrote: > Here are my thoughts . . . > > I believe that you have to use a manual transmission > when doing an electric conversion because the > automatic transmissions need to have pressure in the > system in order to do the shifting/. Since the > electric motor is at 0 RPMs at a stop, there > wouldn't by anything to keep the pressure up in the > transmission to allow you to shift to reverse for > example. However, I thought I saw a gizmo online > that you could use to allow you to use an automatic > transmission. > > Also, automatic transmissions are geared to allow > for an engine's usable torch range, which is usually > pretty high (2,000 RPMs and higher), but the > electric motor has all of its torch at 0 RPMs, so it > is common to have your car in 2nd gear when going > from 0 MPH to 45 MPH, then shift into a lower gear, > 1st gear becomes obsolete in an electric car. > > Bill > > -----Original Message----- > From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org > [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] On Behalf Of Nev > Okyay > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 12:33 PM > To: oeva-list at oeva.org > Subject: [Oeva-list] manual or automatic > transmission.. > > > which would be easier to convert? > is it easier to build/find an adaptor plate for the > motor for manual transmission? or is this just a > driving preference? any thoughts on this? > > thanks > - nev > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oeva-list mailing list > Oeva-list at oeva.org > http://www.rdrop.com/mailman/listinfo/oeva-list > From performanceaev at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 08:01:24 2008 From: performanceaev at yahoo.com (Jim Berry) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:01:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] EV Business space Message-ID: <556500.62484.qm@web46404.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Hello all, I am new to the list so please bear with me. I have been searching for a suitable warehouse area for my EV operation and cannot seem to find anything that trips my trigger. Most small warehouses (3000 +/-) have not been situated or are exorbitant in cost because they are easily leased. But I have come across many larger units (10,000 sq. ft.) that are reasonable? but to large for one person (at the moment) and was wondering if there were other operations out there that may want to go in together to share space? It could also translate into sharing?advertising, special equipment (mills / lathes / etc.) keeps everyones cost down and makes for better exposure. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080828/a7cedbed/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Thu Aug 28 13:26:42 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 13:26:42 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Bill Moore on Portland Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808281326x33cea402se621c7270af24ce3@mail.gmail.com> Bill Moore of EV World was in Portland for the Meeting of the Minds transportation future conference. He had some nice things to say about Portland and our electrically powered public transportation system. enjoy. *Riding the Max* > Part of the Portland experience is riding their wonderful light rail > system, which we could board just a block from our hotel. Running through > the heart of downtown Portland at street level, the three-line system (Red, > Blue Yellow) links Beaverton in the West and Gresham in the east, with the > Red line also running out to the airport, which is really handy. Riding the > Max isn't cheap; an all day pass is $4.25, a two-hour pass is $2.25, but it > sure beats having to find someplace to park a car. Cyclists even have space > to hang their bikes inside the cars. > > My wife and I rode the Max three times: once out to the Ikea store -- she's > always wanted to visit one -- yesterday out to the Japanese Gardens and Rose > Gardens, and then out to the airport to catch our flight home. It's a pity > other cities are just now catching on to the concept when costs have > ballooned out of sight. One presenter at the conference said that a city he > was familiar with has to subsidize their light-rail system to the tune of > $100,000 per rider annually. > > Given the direction gasoline prices seem headed over the long-run, not only > is ridership climbing on these systems, but so is community interest from > those who weren't quite as enlightened as Portland was when it decided to > invest in it back in the 70's. > > Oh yes, and it is, of course, all-electric. > -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080828/4a133e0f/attachment.html From bob at research13.com Thu Aug 28 16:17:15 2008 From: bob at research13.com (bob at research13.com) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 23:17:15 +0000 Subject: [Oeva-list] EV Business space Message-ID: Would an airplane hanger work? There are some heated and plumbed hangers that are under contruction in Newberg at Sportsman Airpark { (503) 538-2134 } as well as other warehouses around there. There rates start at $130 per month. The Port of Portland managed Mulino, Hillsboro and Troutdale. Not sure of the Port's contact, however, they may be a good resources as they are supposed to help with mfrs if you are a commercial venture. Scappose and Aurora airports also advertise warehouse space from time to time. Some of the people building airplanes may also be willing to share space - Vans Aircraft at Aurora might know someone. One trade off is the airplane noise. -----Original Message----- From: Jim Berry [mailto:performanceaev at yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 08:01 AM To: oeva-list at oeva.org Subject: [Oeva-list] EV Business space Hello all, I am new to the list so please bear with me. I have been searching for a suitable warehouse area for my EV operation and cannot seem to find anything that trips my trigger. Most small warehouses (3000 +/-) have not been situated or are exorbitant in cost because they are easily leased. But I have come across many larger units (10,000 sq. ft.) that are reasonable but to large for one person (at the moment) and was wondering if there were other operations out there that may want to go in together to share space? It could also translate into sharing advertising, special equipment (mills / lathes / etc.) keeps everyones cost down and makes for better exposure. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080828/c6fd26b6/attachment.html From performanceaev at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 21:36:58 2008 From: performanceaev at yahoo.com (Jim Berry) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 21:36:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Introduction Message-ID: <33270.66506.qm@web46411.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I received an email from Tim the other day informing me that there were people wondering who I was, and that it might do good to introduce myself. Please bear with me?here because as I write this, I am also getting schooled by?my girlfriend in?the correct use of grammer?as she edits the new website before it goes up. ? My name is Jim Berry, I operate Performance AEV, and I supply the donuts and drinks at the OEVA meetings.?We have a temporary website at www.performanceaev.com?that we hope to have replaced this weekend, and on the "Who is Performance AEV" there will be a picture of me and my son so that?you will?be able to identify me, which I hope is a good thing. ? On the new website, I also have a links page where I am attempting to provide?links (obviously) to other shops and things of interest to the EV community. So, if there are any businesses or items that I can help promote, please write me at performanceaev at yahoo.com so they can be included. ? At one time I found a sort of perverse satisfaction at being labeled the king of the late brakers when I was participating in SCCA roadracing.?I have just now been informed that I am also the king of the run on sentence,?which unless?I am mistaken, is not a?compliment. So with that nugget of information bouncing around in my noggin, I will take my leave. Everyone be safe!! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080828/98b17c67/attachment.html From tim_kutscha at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 08:07:23 2008 From: tim_kutscha at yahoo.com (Tim Kutscha) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 08:07:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Oeva-list] Introduction Message-ID: <997047.22490.qm@web110502.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Hi Jim, Thanks for the introduction. Also, many thanks for bringing the doughnuts to the OEVA meetings and facilitating the EV small-business sub-group. Have a great Labor Day weekend everyone. Cheers, Tim Kutscha OEVA Chair ----- Original Message ---- From: Jim Berry To: oeva-list at oeva.org Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 9:36:58 PM Subject: [Oeva-list] Introduction I received an email from Tim the other day informing me that there were people wondering who I was, and that it might do good to introduce myself. Please bear with me here because as I write this, I am also getting schooled by my girlfriend in the correct use of grammer as she edits the new website before it goes up. My name is Jim Berry, I operate Performance AEV, and I supply the donuts and drinks at the OEVA meetings. We have a temporary website at www.performanceaev.com that we hope to have replaced this weekend, and on the "Who is Performance AEV" there will be a picture of me and my son so that you will be able to identify me, which I hope is a good thing. On the new website, I also have a links page where I am attempting to provide links (obviously) to other shops and things of interest to the EV community. So, if there are any businesses or items that I can help promote, please write me at performanceaev at yahoo.com so they can be included. At one time I found a sort of perverse satisfaction at being labeled the king of the late brakers when I was participating in SCCA roadracing. I have just now been informed that I am also the king of the run on sentence, which unless I am mistaken, is not a compliment. So with that nugget of information bouncing around in my noggin, I will take my leave. Everyone be safe!! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080829/437e93eb/attachment.html From glassphoto at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 13:59:40 2008 From: glassphoto at gmail.com (Micheal Drewry) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 13:59:40 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation In-Reply-To: References: <43e1e6a70808141415q6373f25ch2918f842a656de91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43e1e6a70808291359y4b1aecbck759676a746e28cab@mail.gmail.com> Gary, couple of questions about what you wrote. (Thanks for the comments by the way!) *See below.* On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 2:40 PM, Graunke, Gary wrote: > I suspect it is the Blue 175A Anderson connector (same as on my PFC50). > The color is important! > > *Yes, it is the SB50 Anderson connector that is required (Thanks Ralph) > and EV Parts sent me extras to use. > * > > The pins take 4 gauge wire on the 175A connector. This is plenty big for > charging (and I have spools of it if you need some). > > Make sure that your charger is connected to the pack before the AC power is > turned on. The charger is not isolated. > > *I saw that comment in the manual that came with the charger. I'm not > sure what "isolated" really means. Does this mean that if I turn on the > charger and the output cables are not connected to anything, bad things may > happen to the charger? And, can I apply power to the charger if the switch > on the PFC is off? Or does "not isolated" mean that AC power will still be > passing through? > * > > I used to have two Kilovac contactors that engaged when AC power was > connected to the charger. I would turn the charger off by the switch, so > the pack was connected when power was available, and before I turned the > switch. This would also isolate the pack from the charger when AC power was > off. My car uses two contactors between the batteries and the motor > controller, so the pack was isolated from the motor, DC-DC, etc when not > driving. > > *"used to"? Do you not use them any more? I like the idea of using 2 > contactors to isolate the electronics. Mine only uses 1 large contactor so > I can't do that now. The original design I used with the Russco charger > had some 120V relays to break some of the connections when the charger came > on. I'm assuming that I can't use those any longer as this charger could be > using 240V power sometimes. Are there contactors or relays that would do > this job and work for both 240 and 120? > > > And one more question on power. How do you deal with using both 120 > and/or 240V? Do you use 2 different power cords? I was thinking of using > one 10 gage cord but having different ends I could plug in to switch between > 120 and 240? Do you see any problems doing this? (assuming I wire them > correctly). > > Thanks again for all your advice and help. > > Mike* > > Gary > > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org [mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] *On > Behalf Of *Micheal Drewry > *Sent:* Thursday, August 14, 2008 2:16 PM > *To:* OEVA > *Subject:* [Oeva-list] Question on PFC 20 installation > > > > Hi all, > > I just heard from EV Parts my PFC-20 is shipping next week. This is the > replacement for my failed Russco charger. > > Quick question for anyone who has installed one of these before. Does it > come with the Anderson connectors I need? My current charger uses a very > small connector on 14 gage wire and it looks like the ones coming out of the > PFC are on very thick wires that look close to the size of wire I'm using > between the batteries. > > Also, any other issues I need to be aware of? > > Any advice greatly appreciated. Thanks all! > > Mike Drewry > http://www.evalbum.com/1371 > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080829/3379ba01/attachment.html From patrick0101 at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 23:54:08 2008 From: patrick0101 at gmail.com (patrick0101 at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 23:54:08 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Smart Garage (V2G) Summit in Portland Message-ID: <8c28d7b50808302354t36e2a1b2j4a4b56334039e1dd@mail.gmail.com> * RMI's Smart Garage Summit * We are pleased to announce that RMI's Smart Garage Summit has been scheduled > to take place in Portland, Oregon on October 8-10, 2008. The concept of the > Smart Garage, which was captured in RMI's July 2008 Solutions Journal, > is a sweeping idea which could change the way we interact with energy > systems in our society. Although this three-day summit is not open to the > public, we're very excited about this exciting event that will introduce a > new energy paradigm. We look forward to providing you more information along > with photos after October 10! > Is anyone on the list going? -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080830/859349fb/attachment.html From Rick.Durst at pgn.com Sun Aug 31 14:20:27 2008 From: Rick.Durst at pgn.com (Rick Durst) Date: Sun, 31 Aug 2008 14:20:27 -0700 Subject: [Oeva-list] Smart Garage (V2G) Summit in Portland Message-ID: <9ECCD1FF821C4247B03C280FE8EBAEE36C9117C60B@APEXMAIL.corp.dom> I will be going as a representative of PGE. I will share whatever they will allow us to share. Rick Durst ________________________________ From: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org To: OEVA Sent: Sat Aug 30 23:54:08 2008 Subject: [Oeva-list] Smart Garage (V2G) Summit in Portland RMI's Smart Garage Summit We are pleased to announce that RMI's Smart Garage Summit has been scheduled to take place in Portland, Oregon on October 8-10, 2008. The concept of the Smart Garage, which was captured in RMI's July 2008 Solutions Journal, is a sweeping idea which could change the way we interact with energy systems in our society. Although this three-day summit is not open to the public, we're very excited about this exciting event that will introduce a new energy paradigm. We look forward to providing you more information along with photos after October 10! Is anyone on the list going? -- Regards, Pat Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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