[Oeva-list] Time of Use
ianaudio at aracnet.com
Sun Apr 28 13:36:29 PDT 2013
I always thought that the PGE TOU was abusive, from the first time I
read about it. It makes no sense to me why there needs to be the
punitive peak rate and the meter charge. There are people home at my
house all day. Expecting them to not use energy at all during peak times
is ridiculous, but I I wold be more than happy to move my ev charging to
late night, since I have a fast charger. I thought that California had a
system that was basic rate most of the time with som late night off peak
On 2013-04-28 13:21, Myles Twete wrote:
Great writeup Pat, and congrats on your limited success with the TOU
> We've been TOU customers now for several years
now---since first that PGE offered it.
> The program is only
marginally fair in my opinion.
> Hidden costs: When I put the
numbers into the calculator before we joined, it appeared we would save
some $15/month or more. This was based on the On/Mid/Off peak rates they
quoted & comparing with the Basic rate. But the story wasn't made clear.
The advertised rates didn't include "T&D charges", nor did it mention
that there'd be an additional $10/month "meter fee" to participate in
the plan. Together, these made our first month results nearly a wash as
compared to the Basic plan---and that was AFTER putting OFF-peak timers
on BOTH our hot water heater and our hot tub! So while I figured these
timers would pay for themselves within a few months, ultimately, we
saved only about $2-4 month as I figure. Now, since most or all
customers now have "smart" meters, why do we still have to pay $10/month
for this fee? Does everyone pay this now?
> TOU Calculator: The
calculator may also not tell the whole story. But how could you know?
Once you've switched from Basic, you no longer have a way to directly
compare apples to apples since fees & other costs change.
knows what the T&D (transmission and distribution) rates are. Yet in
advertising TOU's low rates, PGE does not include the T&D amounts even
though they know what they are. This obfuscation is intentional in order
to make the TOU OFF-peak power rate seem incredibly low and attractive.
> The reality: Look at the bottom line cost. Through the year, our
TOU bill, when divided by actual KWH delivered ends up running between a
low of 9cents/kwh to a high of 26cents/kwh. Why so high? Go on vacation
during the month, using little electricity. You'll still have that
$10/month plus a host of other fees that will weigh against you.
On average, we're looking at an average of about 12-cents/kwh counting
all. And that's with 82.5% OFF, 7.1% MID, and 10.3%ON peak average
annual usage. This also with an average of 152kwh/mo SOLAR to PGE and
537kwh/mo from PGE.
> So we meet that 80% shift that PGE talks
about, yet we pay on average 12-cents/kwh total cost. Would we pay less
or more with Basic?
> Still with TOU, but it should be so much more
fair I think…
> FROM: oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org
[mailto:oeva-list-bounces at oeva.org] ON BEHALF OF patrick0101 at gmail.com
SENT: Saturday, April 27, 2013 10:32 PM
> TO: OEVA
[Oeva-list] Time of Use
> I have been on time-of-use with PGE for
just over a year now. Today I crunched the numbers and calculated that I
saved $65 during our 12 months on TOU.
> Most months we saved just a
couple bucks. The best two months we saved over $11. There was one month
(Feb) where TOU cost $1.76 more than standard service would have, but
this was more than made up for by the other months.
> For more gory
details, you can read about here:
> Sunlight will never cost $4/gallon
> Oeva-list mailing
> Oeva-list at oeva.org
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